Invisible Ships podcast
Invisible Ships podcast

Episode · 11 months ago

UFO Disclosure or Deception?

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

The truth is out there and so are the lies..... 

By now almost everyone has heard that the U.S Government is expected to release a report this month on UFO sightings, how they are being investigated and what the U.S. military is going to be doing about them. We never thought we would live to see this but it is actually happening. In fact, the Defense Department has already declassified three videos that seem to show strange craft that move erratically and at times even seem to defy physics. 

So what does all of this mean? And more importantly, how can we trust the government after 70 years of lies, coverups, and secrecy to suddenly start telling us the truth about UFOs?  

For this episode, we invited our friend Fred from the Podcast Chronic Curiosity to go over all of our hopes and concerns about what the Government's report will and won't tell us. We get into some pretty deep stuff everything from quantum mechanics to New World Order PSYOP and what all of this has to with the UFO phenomenon. 

It's time for the invisible ship's podcast, where we talk about everything from true crime to the truly weird invisibles podcast. I wanted to have an open and honest conversation about the sudden one hundred and eighty, and you know it's a one hundred and eighty, that the government is doing about its UFO project, and to do that we wanted to invite our good friends from the podcast chronic curiosity, and half of them have agreed to join us. Tony couldn't make it, but we have fred here and we're really excited to get into this. If you don't already know, chronic curiosity is one of our favorite podcasts. It's sometimes hilariously inappropriate, but a lot of times it's very, very deep, and talked about everything from Bitcoin to the nature reality, usually while drinking a whole lot of Bourbon, which I totally approve of. And they have an interest in ufos. That right, we know in respect, though, so they needed to be here. So, Freddy, you with us. I am so you know, guys, it's almost June. The director of National Intelligence has until June twenty five to produce an unclassified report on everything that the government knows about ufos. You guys excited about that? Excited, seriously interested, great, excited for a lot of black highlighter. Yeah, you think there's going to be a lot of reactions in that? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I'm really interested to hear what here, what you think, Fred, but my kind of realistic expectation is one or two nuggets a really interesting things are maybe just acknowledgements and then a bunch of redaction. You know, I totally agree. I think it's more of a like like the government typically operates. It's they'll give you one or two nuggets of something buried in a million pieces of nothing. Yeah, as that's my that's my prediction. I'm just feeling that they're using the UAP or the ufo videos. I feel like we're all about to be part of some kind of syop or misdirection, and it's so weird to me that I trust the government more to lie to us than to tell us the truth. And like when the government is lying to me, like I feel okay, like this is the way that it's supposed to be. Right. I don't expect them to be truthful with anything, specially national security stuff, but let me jump in real quick to lay a little bit of a foundation, because this is one of the places where, mean rack of been button heads. But I think we found some common ground. We both agree that at least some of these videos are authentically unknown and not just easy to explain, and we're going to jump into it. And so it's not just a psyoup as in the CIA is making up these videos like we think there are at least a handful authentic, more than likely alien, I'm just going to say, are at least a crazy advanced achnology. Right? We all agree on that? Yeah, you know, I will. I'll jump in. You mentioned the podcast that the it you guys have been on that we do credit curiosity and just to kind of to tie that in, I have something a little bit to throw out there for you what you guys have mentioned. But you know we, like you mentioned in the beginning, it's you know, we look or look for open and honest and just kind of conversation right on. That's that's just it. No matter what it is, we're just looking for conversation and good conversation because, you know, so many times these days you get we're surrounded by social media and so what? That's thousands and millions of people just screaming at each other all the time. So what good are you getting out of that? And until you can sit down and talk to somebody, you know what I want, and find out, you know, what they know or what they think or what they feel, whatever you know. And I kind of see as the government kind of as like an old school social media. It's just a bunch of people screaming at each other. They have no idea what they're talking about, none of them. I mean. So I think when we consider the government and you know them putting up this information is, you know, oftentimes I think people give the government too much yes, I've been saying first right here, respect or maybe not, maybe not too much credit. No, it's too much credit. Government's not one guy, it's a thousand, hundred thousand different people, and all of these videos are disgruntled people that are leaking at because they're pissed that the government isn't addressing this. So yes, I think the government is never going to waste a crisis or whatever or an opportunity. But there's some real meat on these bones that I think, I think is more interesting to talk about for sure, absolutely, and that's and that's the thing is, you know what's is the government telling us the truth, or aren't they or whatever it is they can finally declassify? You know, that's who knows, but I think that's one thing. The first step is to understand that. You know, when we're talking to we're talking about what the government's giving us as its citizens. Well, you know, you made a point. There's there's thousands of people in the government. So you can't trust each source or expect them to have all of the...

...answers, because I mean a lot of if you pay attention to politics at all, men, a lot of them probably should be in that position to begin with. Yeah, they're all it is. I agree with that. You guys, speaking of that, have any idea just how many employees are in the Homeland Security Vision of the government? I'm going to let yeah, go ahead, go ahead, fed, I'm gonna Guess Eight thousand. My guess is five hundred thousand. Okay, so it's two hundred and forty thousand, which, when I saw that number I thought that was unbelievable. So, I mean that's just one part of the governments. The newest is like the newest part of the government too. Yeah, it is the newest part of the government, like what after eleven, but they are responsible for probably a lot of stuff that has to do with ufos. And that's how you call it out, wasting an opportunity. Nine hundred and eleven you get a new branch the government. Exactly. I just realized I brain farted and forgot. Space Force is the most recent friends of the government. Sorry, and I know everyone likes to laugh at Space Force and make fun of it, but it's so appro pole. I mean it's may have more to do with what's going on what we're about to find out, and we realize at the time of its creation. The reason that we invited you, Fred, from chronic curiosity, is because we appreciate your style, not only of being interested in all things, because you guys really are very broad podcast, but that you believe in you know, just it's important to have open dialog and and you know, he know, you know your stuff, like yeah, but when we were there, I don't even know if it get made your podcast, but you're talking about, you know, the Graham handcocks and you know all the people right loose Alisando. Yeah, like you know your stuff. So this, you know, this really kind of hit the ground running in like two thousand and seventeen. December, two thousand and seventeen is when all the stuff really started releasing. The the trickle that is becoming like an avalanche started, and so I know you've been on top of all of this. And just before we dive into it, Rick has some great questions that he came up with. But before we dive into what is your overall kind of thought on like, you know, I'm time with the tic tech videos, the recent Jeremy Corbel videos from the Omaha and all that. Like what are your thoughts on all of it? You know. So it's a good, good starting there because you know, I kind of look at things and it's kind of the reason the podcast got started was, you know, I look at things from a curious perspective. You know, for my entire life I've often got yelled at for asking questions and sometimes because, you know, I'm asking my boss why we do something this way and they take offense to it and just I just want to know why. You know, if somebody says a word that I don't know which Tony, the other guy, but often does. He's a nurs practitioner and knows all the he's he knows a lot of big words. But you know, I'm always just curious. So I like to approach you know, in my in my my mind, I'm always thinking. I like to answer questions with other questions, because you can't find any more outless you're asking questions. So I think one of the biggest things with the whole alien thing is you know whether, regardless of what it is, you know what's the what's out there. And we've obviously had all of these people that have seen something or have a story, and you know, I don't believe them all by any means. I've met plenty of people that, you know, have some strange thoughts. So you know, not all these stories are going to be true, but there's there's something happening that that somebody that we can't explain, you know, and now that the the government has came out and said we can't explain this either. All Right, why isn't this getting more and voice to it? Like, why are more people concerned with this? Like just the implications that, even if it's aliens or whatever it is, that there's something out there that we don't understand what's going on. Yeah, you know, I think the scariest thing would probably be if it's another country. Are the military implications for our government? And why are they choosing now to be honest with us, as opposed to any time in the past? I think so. Just really we know why now, because Marco Rubio, who you know, I'm not his biggest fan put that way, and another guy put into the cares act that they want it. They have them on a hundred eighty days release this. So credit to them. We're getting this release because of them. So that's why that's happening. They handles forced and I think overall, as far as all these videos coming out and everything and everyone having, you know, like some of these new phones, like the new iphone in the new stampsun they like these amazing cameras,...

...like everybody has a camera, so everyone's recording the shit. So their hands are forced. And now what they have to prepare for is when they say they've already kind of said it, like what Fred was saying. They've already kind of said so the overton windows already shifted. That the government saying, yeah, there are these things, they're doing things that and according to Jeremy Corpville and George Nap, we've tried our anti drone technology on it just doesn't work. So there's these things. They can swarm our battleships and do whatever the hell they want and we can't do anything. So basically, the US military is no longer the most powerful military force on earth. So that changes everything. Might still be the most powerful and earth, but not in the universe. Those things. Know, those things are on earth. CALTURE company closes on Earth. That scary. It does make a point and that is part of earth, but I think even that they may not even so this may be getting a little off topic. I'm really good at that. So if you guys have your guys, may have to keep me on topic. If you want me on top, you're asking the wrong guys, as Ye'm gonna jumping around. But this may not be a military thing. You know these things that are out there, they could I I'm a I'm one of these people that I look at something that can't be explained and I like to something that can't be explained is really exciting to me because then I can think about all of the other things surrounding that thing that can't be explained either. You know, whether it be things in science, like, you know, when scientists started seeing anti gravity and dark matter and antimatter, and, you know, they say, well, they're there and you ask him, well, what is it? I don't know, but it's there. Okay, so now now we can speculate. Now we can have fun with an idea and say, okay, what about this? What about that? Maybe it's aliens, maybe it's, you know, China or Russia, maybe it's, you know, black people say, well, it's probably our own government, just messing around with us. Well, that doesn't make make sense, because why would they mess around with their own crew and then pretend like it wasn't them? And I don't, I don't believe it's us. I think that would be silly. But what if it's? It could be interdimensional, you know, there's that theory out there too. And maybe it's not extraterrestrial, maybe it's Intra Trust ultra is the one I like. Or Ultra. Oh yeah, ultra terrestrial. I think that's what they calling at. So there's a lot of theories out there that I enjoy looking at these things because it's just because there's a lack of evidence doesn't mean that lack of evidence proves that there's nothing there. HMM. It just means that we just haven't figured out what that evidence is yet. When he raised a lot of really cool points, and that it brings to mind. I found this website and I said it to you and I've sent it to a million people and I just talked about your fos to my family and they walk out of the room and I keep talking. But there's this looks like called you AP theorycom and it's from a purported astro physicist and he says he's just still hasn't decided whether or not he wants to put his name on it and he doesn't claim to know anything. But what he said was, watching all these videos, he thought the only thing crazier than aliens coming to Earth would be an aircraft violating the laws of physics on Earth. So he said these aircraft have to have to follow laws of physics and the way that they move in the acceleration speeds and change of direction and no exhaust porter wings and all that. The only way that makes sense is if, basically, they are constantly in a free fall on the geodesic curve of like time space. So, like the way that astronauts floating zero gravity or the way that a baseball floats in the air when it's thrown, it's falling a geodesic curve, and the way astronots feels zerog. Whoever's inside these uape's feels zerog and that's how they can go under water and space in and our air, because they kind of have a bubble around them. So I recommend everybody check out you ape theorycom but like they're talking about like how it will link to that on our web page to so, and it's basically is involving quantum gravity and basically it's manipulating quantum entanglement using data transmitted through light, which is why they put out light. And while they seem to have this bubble around them that distorts the air around them and objects behind it. But like the quantum gravity is related to quantum mechanics that we use in computing every day. So it's not even like out of this world. So, like I feel like there is the beginning of an explanation for this and like this theory. I mean it explains how track your beans would were account of visibility cloaking would work, but it's it's nothing China is doing. It's nothing Russia's doing. Like Russia's the economy size of Italy, like another's smart. And I do respect Russia because they have, like, you know, they like rick you were saying, like they've always said, great rock get sciences and all that stuff. They're no dummies, but they're not light years ahead of everybody else in China's either. China would have invaded us. Yeah, and, like you said, in time, WAN would definitely. I wander ques seen about who Taiwan belongs to. Fred, do you...

...think any part of you think that what is out there, what people are reporting, could be from another government that is in the US? Yeah, so I think. You know, I have a couple of theories that I don't necessarily wholeheartily believe any of them, but I have a couple that are ranked, you know it and some kind of fashion in my mind, and that's that's definitely ranked towards the lower end. You know, like I said, most people that if I can't prove it wrong, that mean I I can't prove it right or wrong, that I can't get rid of it. I always make the joke that you know, I I don't know that the earth is round right, or spherical rather, you know, because I haven't seen it for myself. I think it is and I believe that they're you know, think I'm not a flat earth or no offense to those that are. I'll give you the way to prove it. When the UAP goes into the water more than twelve kilometers out from you and you can't see at the water, that's the curature of the earth. I never thought that Earth was flat, but two thousand and twenty in two thousand and twenty one are making me rethink everything. Of ufos are real. Are we going to find out that ghosts a real next door like who knows, like what the next disclosure is going to be. So I'm not saying any think for sure any longer, but I do think. You know, dam brought up a really interesting he threw a lot out there with that length. There is a lot is good on that link. Yeah, you know, and I I look into this stuff a lot. I look because I'm just I look at a lot of things a lot and you know, I'm not a physicist. I am by far from a quantum physicist. You know, because that's one of my favorite lines with quantum physics and became mechanics. Is If you think you understand it, that means you don't understand it. You know, that's part of a carry. I think you've seen the our crowd of carrioshity shirts with Schrodinger's cats and you know that the reasemblance of quantum mechanics and it's fascinating. Yeah, and is particularly when he was mentioned. You know, the the geodesics is it's and maybe this is just me having fun, but it's really interesting that, you know what he was mentioned. There is, you know, when I like when a space station is orbiting the earth. You know, I heard US explain once and it was it was really interesting to think about that, that the the space station isn't going around the earth. The space station is trying to move it a straight line and just like when they launch rockets up in the space is, they launch some of they launch them straight up, but then what they do is they angle im sideways so they can get that the inertia and that movement to actually break out of, you know, that that stronghold of the atmosphere and earth's gravity. And then as the as they're orbiting the earth, said, through in that zero g or that you know, the Zerr g environment, where they're feel like they're floating. But really what they're doing is that space station or whatever it may be, is it's going at a straight line, but it's going a straight line fast enough, or slow enough rather, that the earth gravity is keeping it at the exact same spot, yea from the center of the Earth. I love that's what we think about, is orbiting. You know, it's not really moving around the earth, it's just moving fast enough and slow enough that it's not getting closer to the earth or further away from it. Another asolation I've heard. I just want a real quick is if you're in a droptop convertible going like sixty miles now and you're not buckled and like you jump up and land back down your seat. Yeah, how come you don't fly off into the road? It's because you're you're moving with the convertible like you're you're you know, like see, you're I don't know if the totally applies, but it's that whole idea. Like what what you're talking about is that harnessing the forces of kind of nature and inertia. It's pretty cool. Now, if you were now, if you were to stand up on the back of the convertible or seeing up in the backs, like stand up in the back seat and jump really high, you might end up off the back of it. But if you do that like a a bus, you know what I mean. Yeah, it's and close environment. Yeah, because you have that movement. But it seemed just that are that you put a dime on your knee. Yeah, I always hard to kill somebody doing that. Yeah, may not be ill enough for that. That's an old styf call that before. I sat on in Cedar Point with the Penny or diame on the demon drop and we always try to catch them right before it went underneath. But that's the interesting thing about some of the stuff is when I have another saying that I like to say, I'm sure I heard it from somewhere when considering these crazy things that we used to think we're crazy, is that the experts are always wrong. And I know it's I'm using very general terms and loose things...

...here, but throughout history the people that were considered experts during your time have eventually been proven wrong. Yes, not big not because they were trying to be wrong or they were stupid or whatever. It is just as we grow older and our civilization and technologies increase, we continue to get smarter, we continue to learn more, so we continue to in a sense, prove ourselves wrong. Now there's things in like physics that have kind of held fast for a long time. But what do you consider a long time? Because physics is I have only been around for what two hundred years, hundred fifty years or so? Well, you know, it's interesting like what we're talking about now. You mentioned orbiting and stuff like this. So you're going back to Newton and then some of our understanding about further was further, you know, specified by Einstein. Like new knew he didn't have the whole picture and it wasn't until Einstein where he really kind of understood what the play was between two masses and he figured out the whole spacetime thing. But even new or Einstein realized that we didn't have a whole picture. And so whatever these ufos or uaps are, well, they might be further along on understanding that. Well, in which really cool. You bring up and I don't even know if you are doing some purpose, but so Newtonian physics. You know, which what was I'd I've definitely was not paying enough attention school. Sixteen hundred thousand, five hundred and sixty hundreds, something like that. Yeah, yeah, I may ass a two hundred, a hundred fifty years that that was grossly wrong, but it's only been a couple hundred year. Yeah, you've been studying physics, well, geological. You're talking about astrophysics. Are Astro physics and like theory of relativity and let all that stuff. But anyways, so new Tony Physics covers like what we can observe on earth. MMM, but it stops working when you get to quantum level. But quantum physics works for that. But if you look at quantum start to blow it up, it stops working when you get big and you have to go back to Newtonian. When you get really big, that stops working. You have to go to theory of relativity and like Einstein physics. And I don't like. I stopped taking maths in ten grade because I just took all I had to do what I was done because I'm not good at math. Yeah, I just can lay my bills right right. I don't even know how much. I'm probably wrapped out everybody. But like, but it's cool because there is an encompassing somewhere out there, and is but all the sides are aways looking for there's an encompassing theory of everything. We're not quite there yet, but we do know enough to know about like the different ways it works. That again, and these people, they don't claim that they can build a UAP. Then didn't claim that they're right, but they're just saying that if their theory works, then you should expect to see these things and everything they say you should expect to see lines up. So like yeah, so go ahead. Also want to say is it's to me, and I'm becoming such a full believer, so don't worry about me. But like, to me that says it's nothing. It's not China, Russia or like I always think, like it would have to be like South Korea or Japan or someone that advanced enough to make something great but like pascifist enough not to attack everybody. But like it's not. It doesn't even come from the evolutionary tree of like the combustion engine and absolutely and Jet Propulsion, like it's underste ending of the Indians. Nothing it's different. Understand enough engines, I mean how was not putting out any kind of heat signature or exhaust trail, like, but it's still real revolutionary. Yeah, still real. It's still like it still has to adhere to physics. I just so easier time believing they could be anything other than we're so far behind it. I don't know if that's just kind of like a perspective that I have as being an American and being used to being aheaded on. You tell me that China has a better fighter jet than us, like I believe that. Like I don't believe that they have a and this technology would revolutionize life on earth as we know it. Like yeah, so it's like saying that, like this country has a propotional emotion, you know what I mean? Like what? Like we weren't even close to that. What kind of what? Where is this place where that like they've, you, got a way to feed all their people? It's just water. Really, those countries would have, would have used it to their advantage. At this point, I don't know, knowing enough about people right so I think I think we can assume a couple things, and it kind of brings me back to what you just said, Danto, that the the idea that this is another country. Well, let me me say this first. You know, I think, well, I would imagine most people, they're listening to you guys as podcasts, are already interested in, you know, the strange, you know, as it were. But I always like to I always run into to people that still think like Oh, ufos are crazy, or you know some of these things that are just wild. Well, you know, you mentioned rick. You know the different things about the propulsion and there's no wings on these and you know they move in ways that we can't explain. There's plenty of information out there that, if you're not carrying a curious enough to just look at it and go okay, this is strange, we should be looking at this, then I don't want to tell you. So we'll...

...cast those people aside because I don't want to tell him right. Um, you know, we've it's we've essentially all agree that it's not another country, because any other country would have put this to use in some kind of way. I and they would be far leaps and bounds ahead of us. So I'm totally on board with that. This is very, very not likely that this is another country in because of the whole science thing that we were discussing and, you know, bringing in the I think the original original reason I was talking about the orbiting with the space station in the gravity is is in my mind, it's the the best explanation and I think this is kind of the you know, the same idea that that link that you share with me kind of discussed. Was for there's a normal persons thought processes. Somehow these things are using. Well, my best guess is gravity as a source of motion, because if you know anything about people that I've brought up, Einstein, and you know their theories and everything else is, you know, gravity and time are intermingled. So you know, you get close to a black hole and time slows down because the gravity is so great. So you know these I that'd be my best guess. If it is another craft, if it's not some kind of you know, interdimensional ghost or big foot, you know, out there with a squashlight flying around. You know, gravity seems to be, from our understanding of our physics, to be the best case scenario. And then one of the no, you go ahead and I think it going back to the you know, the experts, row is wrong is. I remember the first time, once again, I said it earlier, but when I heard a scientist talk about like antimatter and anti gravity and it was like antigravity, there's no way that's a thing. Well then, now we know anti gravity and dark matter and antimatter, these are all things. Now they're having a hard time explaining them right. But as we move through history and we learn more and more, we find out more and more that, oh, this necessarily isn't breaking the laws of physics that we knew. We're just kind of adding to how we understand that Lee. We're just changing our magnifying glass to leave it look further outer, look further in, and that's a lot of the kind of common working theory on this that comes from this UAP theory. But Louis alsando is referenced it to. They think it's like some type of a gravity propulsion system. And basically the way it's kind of described as like if, if spacetime is kind of like a net of interconnected points of quantum entanglement. When you're going really fast those points are squishing together, when you're going really slow they're stretching out. So somehow these things are using light and some source of power, but they said that starts of power wouldn't have to be crazy. It might be nuclear, but wouldn't be crazy. You like manipulate these points in spacetime to, like you said, use gravity to basically free fall any direction they want all the time. Yeah, and I think that's an important point to make. Is We often think of things was us as humans. You know, we don't like to be wrong. I mean, I know, I don't know, I've gotten why I avoid it. Yeah, point is at all costs. You know, I've gotten much better as I get older to admitting that I was wrong and learning, you know, from those mistakes. But we don't like to be wrong. So I think there's a lot of times it. You know that. I've seen educators and scientists. You know, those are the people that don't want to be wrong the most. You'll degraph because, yeah, yeah, and you'll degrassing. You know, and I think I really like it's funny you bring him up because I really enjoy Neil degrass Tyson. I've read some of his book as his stuff and I've listened to a lot of podcast with him. But a lot of times he approaches the unknown very callously and he kind of like brushes it away like Oh, this is crazy, like I'm you can do what you want, but show me proof. Well, that's just the scientific view. I mean I don't think you get to where he gets without an ego at any level in any industry or any profession. He's a genius. But he's discounting outlets testimony. Like he just discounts that people see these with their eyes. He's trying to say it's all malfunctioning equipment and people see them. Yeah, and that doesn't hold water. It's kind of an embarrassment, I think, to him really to say that. I just want to go on the record right now and say that I don't believe in mass hallucinations really as an explanation for any of these things either. I know that has been tried a lot by the government in the past and that never held up. You know, we just did up. Yeah, unless...

...it happens like during burning man or something like that. Yeah, you know, I've been think all of those grateful dead concert or something. But still, I mean we could get into a whole other episode about like DMT and different stuff like that, but for the most part like drugs. We're not going to see the same thing. We both be on the same drug and will be seen totally different things. Yeah, can I you know what you guys were talking about and kind of explain some of the scientific theories and stuff behind this? Is Fascinating and as you're doing a really good job that. You're gonna hate me, because one of the reasons I wanted to have this conversation is to throw in that. The big what if in that is like, what if we're all being played? And that's why I like, I don't expect you guys to agree with me and it's not important, but I want to throw some stuff at you guys and, you know, shoot him down. Feel free to just say whatever. But there's a couple things I wanted to talk about and before we do that, I want to say like Ufos, friend Dan, it's almost a lot like politics and it's a hard dynamitic get out of because, just like in America, like you only have two real choices between democratic Republican with Ufos, you know what I mean, like they're fake, yeah, or they're real and they're from space, is like. So for the long it's been the only two ways to interpret them only if you frame it from the Americanstimplant. Yeah, you're right. I mean you got to like every y choice up and then ufos people in India and talk to them about it, like they'll be like, yeah, we've been seeing that for thousand years. What else is new? Or like we were referencing a little earlier, we if you really open your mind, there are more than two choices. It could be from our space, they could be from Earth, they could be from the future. Some people think they're feature US visiting, or could be altered terrestrials. Maybe a civilization underwater that just been going out of its way to never talk to us. Has Some Shit have to really I have a really good theory that I'd be willing to share with you later about that as well too. Why wait? Why wait? Let's hear it now. Well, I mean it's really long one. So if we don't necessarily get into it, you know we can get into it. What's a small point, but the elevator pitch? What's the elevator pitch of your theory? So the elevator pitch would be ancient civilizations are older than we think. They knew that natural, massive, natural disasters were coming and they were technologically advanced enough to give us warning signs and protect themselves by living in the ocean, underground, whatever. So sort of maybe tie into the Atlanta Smith or fable or whatever. Yeah, and it will kind of in a sense. But I have a reasonable so this is if I made a comment one time that for some of these things I have reasonable expook explanations for the unreasonable, and the person laughed at it and kind of brushed it off and said, you know, that was just whatever. But I think there's things that you can tie in. It's kind of goes back to if you can't prove it wrong, then I'm not saying it's right. I'm not saying it doesn't sound crazy. I'm just saying, well, for can't prove it wrong, and what if? What if? It's fun to think about. I. Yeah, I mean this. Who knows, because we, I feel like we are at the point. Aside from some maybe pers purposeful contrarians, everyone agrees that there's something going on. So it's like now I have to dress. Where the hell is it coming from? Because there's something out there. So that does open up to well, maybe they're really like maybe it's the dolphins underneath the water, like maybe we only see their stupid cousins and the real smart ways, you know, or the dolphins with thumbs right. We're never seen you. That's because we're right. We have cloaking, just like the police. We're still mad about flipper. Yeah, where's that real? All Right, so let me give us a little bit of structure. Yes, so I can come back to the the government. Make sure you're talking about reckons. Well, sorry, you know, I want this to be an open thing. The way that I look at it is it's either ufos are completely fake and everyone's a correct pot which does not seem to hold any water and especially now that we have some pretty credible, tangible evidence to is that it is another government, which I think we pretty much largely shot that down. Three would be that maybe ufos like. The way I feel this is that ufos are real and some, not all of them, but a lot of the cases that people have experienced ufos like are legit. That doesn't mean that our government wouldn't purposely abuse that and turn the hopes and superstitions of a nation against them or weaponize them or use them to get money. I've been reading a book by Jocko or Jock Valley. I don't know if you ever heard of him. He investigates all the UFOS. He's...

...a a French dude. He was actually one of the yeah, one of the characters. I butcher most French names, so probably screw that one up. Yeah, yeah, I got you. I'm reading his book, I think it's called messengers of deception, and the way that he looks at some of stuff is kind of the way that I think about it. Like he said, this stuck out with me, that Goofos are real. Their physical devices used to affect human consciousness. They may not be from outer space, their purpose maybe to achieve social changes on this planet through a belief system that uses systemic manipulation of witnesses and contact. He's covert use of various sex and cults to control the channels of which alleged space messages can make an impact on the public. Now, that sounds kind of longwinded, but we know for the last seventy five years the government is buried hidden discredited ufo sightings and reports, and we also know that they have not been forthcoming with a lot of stuff right like they have lied to us in the past and they've used it to grow branches of the government. I think that they my own personal belief is that they're addicted to using emergency powers to grow their departments or to clamp down and control. So I'm saying, like, what would stop them from using this forthcoming ufo disclosure to say, Oh my God, like we have a giant national security threat, we need to make new branches the government, we need trillions of dollars in money that no one could account for and we need to suspend parts of the constitution to deal with this. What do you guys thoughts on that? Yeah, you know, I think there's a I think there's some validity to the idea. I will go back to the mention of how many people are in the government, and many of them. You know, I think it's important understand all the nuances of it, because many of them are, you know, elected every two years, some are elected every six years. You know, some aren't elected at all, and it's just nepotism and Cronyism Gone Wild. So I think keeping that in mind, you know, I don't think everybody in the government is is out to get the citizens. Know, I write and I want he got to jump into you, like what we talk about, like support our troops, right, and like we support them when they're their privates, and then when they're sergeants, and then when they're in the FBI, when the the police, like at what level do we stop supporting them and they become evil? Yeah, I think everyone's a little different, you know, and that depends on how they go out through the system. But I do think you know saying that. You know, it's hard to get elected in the higher the offices you go, the harder is to get elected, the more money it takes, you know, and historically, the more pockets have to be lined in order to get where you need to get. And then, you know, at that point you get there, you have to you have to make sure you're what you do gets kicked back to everyone that got you there. Yeah, as how that pre tex, you know what I mean? That's how that for it. Dance with the one that brought you to the party. And I think, Danny, exactly what you were saying. It's kind of like we're told to support our troops and we do. The vast majority of US know people that are in the military and we love them and there are neighbors and brothers and family members and we don't want them to get hurt. But that could also be abused to the point where it's like, don't question why we've been in Afghanistan for twenty years. Yeah, no, I know, you know key, but I think it's I think, at the same time, though, court support there. I think there's a very big difference between supporting the troops and supporting or not supporting an idea that involves the troops. I'm more from pointing out the moving target of when we support and when we don't. Yeah, I'm I'm just gone for hypocrisy here, but these videos are coming from the people that we know. I mean that barbecues and stuff. It's people saying, Hey, this was from the ship, that is what we saw, and they give it to these people who yes, and it is a perfect yeah, way too. Yeah, and you know, I think to your point, Rick, you know, just because that these things are real doesn't mean that the government wholesale or, you know, the powers that be aren't going to try to use it exactly. I think I'll say this very briefly, but I've obviously done I've kept my ear to the ground the last couple of years because we just started the podcast and you know, I got to stay up with recent events and whatnot. You know, I'm a very firm believer that covid nineteen was a real thing, but that doesn't mean that the government can't use it to do certain things. What percent agreed from? One hundred percent. Yes, exactly, and we've had this...

...in conversation a lot, that cod was real, but they're also utilizing emergency powers and abusing the fear of people to gain more control. And I got a crazy theory politicians sometimes lie. They do write. We're staying all these things. Yeah, and here you go real full circle, real quick. You know, covid was real, the covid bills were real, and also what we mentioned earlier that in I covid bill, what we're discussing right now got put into a covid bill, that there's nothing. They had most closed ufos and a hundred eighty days and what with a ted you should you just host the pope a podcast? Those really good and you sound like you're a pro. I just want it because I remember we mentioned that on one of our shows. It's like what I'm like what is this? Like? This is the most ridiculous thing. Like we have everybody. We have millions of people without jobs, people dying, millions of people sick and, oh, by the way, we have to release some UFO stuff and we're going to give a bunch of money to some other countries around the world while we're at it. Here's my crazy thought. So, politicians, so you just real quick. Just because I think the government is a giant cluster doesn't mean conspiracies can't happen. Point in case, operation North Woods was a yeah, crazy one, but that they were trying to do on the fame way. Doesn't know that one one thousand nine hundred and sixty two is a kind of a proposed false flag to harm US military and Sellaban so civilians with plays right? Yeah, what in order to begin military invention, with intervention with Cuba? That was actually authorized by jeint chiefs of staff but shut down by JFK, and well, you know what happened to him. I kind of feel like there was like a threehour brainstorming session at Langley in like late s like you guys are not leaving this room until there's five hundred different ways to kill yes, or Kennedy, ll ste the screw with tank okay, plates they have somebody whacked Adias that all are about Cuba, and then the one guys like Kennedy, and like let's just go on, we're going JIM is, go with Kennedy, I guess, because that's more atatable. Like you said, Rick, you know you have just on that same lines. You Have Project Blue Book, which was what in early s, to want to say around seven, nineteen, seventy, the yeah you talked about. They recorded all this ufo stuff the air force was doing and and you know, they basically said like hey, this is not a national security threat. Anything that we've categorized as unidentified. You know, it doesn't represent technology, like technological developments that we don't know about. And also there's no evidence that, you know, the things that we've categorizes UN identified that were extra trestrial vehicles, and and now all that sudden they say a yeah, we don't know what these things are and they can do things that we don't understand. But the original project Bluebook, that that was that Dr Heinek or whatever, and he's right. He recant it since and said, yeah, I shouldn't have said that. Like there are things we don't understand. He's the swamp guest guy and he went back on it. He said I'd case, yeah, the government last yeah, right, but point in case he did go back on he said I never should have. He said swamp caps was never meant to be for everything. That was for one thing. So point in case, the government tells the truth after the exhausted every plausible path. It's like what up until that Churchill said about Americans. You can count in America to do the right thing after they've tried absolutely everything else. Exactly. I don't know if I've ever heard of I heard that. It's pretty good. Attribute anything it went in. Churchill or mark on my just use that in your podcasts going forward. Just whatever you want. Or Benjamin Freman. Yeah, those are the three guys, so you can feel free to contribute any quote to them. But I've heard that before too and I do believe that's an authentic quote. It I do. It's kind of funny like the United States is the world's like little brother, you know, because we haven't been around that long. That's that's a fun one to look at too, for people haven't how long the United States has been around compared to, you know, the rest of the world. Well, we say you have that map, that little kid, you have that map in your studio which, Hell Yeah, I was fascinated by looking at when we were guests on your show the entire time, where it shows that doferent civilizations, the impact they had, how long they've existed, and we do have a big footprint for being here for a short time. I always say the best thing about the United States, or America as I call it, is that you can't tell some anything, like you can't tell us to do anything. We're just always going to do whatever we want, like the whole mask things like that's it's never gonna work. It was you caught a hundred miles away and now we're not talking about covid and this is a political just you can't not tell Americans what to do. So that's what makes us great. Where the new Vaute Che, Silicon Valley billionaire of if our country had a personality, that would be what I can...

...kind of see that a little bit. Just you know, we've got all this power, all of a sudden is all post war and we're quickly losing it to China. It's like that I'm going to buy this Ming Dynasty Vase for target practice because I can write exactly that kind of stuff. We're the seems like we're the adolescence of the world, that that when we get caught in a lie, it's like wow, I didn't, I didn't do that, like you, like says what. Well, I until we realize that we're full long caught and it's like, okay, we silly side step out of Afghanistan, like know what happened. So let's talk about that, because we're both bringing up things have to do with it, like Lu alsondo and this leak of the ufo stuff. Yeah, Lewis, Lewis Alexon, know, he's part of the to the Stars Academy of Arts and Sciences, or he was. He was part of them. He's back, he's back into the government role, right. Does he still work for the government? No, he doesn't work for the government anymore, but he was a he was a I'm not gonna say top official, but he was one of the guys. And what he claimed that he was in the CIA that was doing some different stuff with so a tip or something like that. I don't I don't know his full story. But he his full story is in the Sarah Blower. I think that he might be hard of a manipulation campaign, and you guys don't have to agree with me. You want his real quick wiki paragraph should. Yeah, so Louis Elsondo is a former US army counterintelligence special agent and former employee of the office of the Under Secretary of defense for intelligence. After his resignation in two thousand and seventeen, which he resigned because he thought they were stowing the stuff, he joined the company to the stars as its director of global security and special programs until he left in late two thousand and twenty. So now I guess he's just a freelancer. So feel free to attack, shootdown or whatever, but I have strong reservations about someone that seems screams Spook, that leaves the Pentagon and goes and works for a media company. To me that seems like a project mocking Er, operation mocking bird kind of set up from the CIA. You have. I don't know. I don't know a whole lot about about him in this scenario, but I did have seen some interviews and stuff with him and you know he it doesn't look a weird scenario. Yeah, and and so like in my mind, you know, going back to kind of how I approach things, is asking questions and I look for the most legitimate or not. Maybe not crazies the word not. I don't know, for the people, the boisterous people, you know, that are trying to get this out there. You know, I kind of look at what evidence am I getting from people like I don't know if you ever heard an interviews with Commander David Feber, yes, the navy pilot that saw the tick tack off of San Diego. Hundred is like a hundred and fifty miles out, and then a cup few a little while after that, another flight team was able to get pictures and stuff. I camera if it was it wasn't Fleir video, some kind of they got some record of it. That's one of the videos out there. You know, it's hard to listen to somebody that has been a naval pilot as a commander, who was a commander for twenty plus years. You know, listened in anybody that hasn't heard that story, I would suggest listening to commander David Feber's discussion with lex Friedman on lex Freeman's podcast, because it is it's long but it's really it's a great conversation. Any time I listened to LEX. I don't know if you guys have listened any lex freedman stuff. Oh, yeah, for sure, but yeah, so I have to listen to him at like two times this speed. I tell people like he's super intelligent, he was an immigrant from Russia. He speaks great English, but he just he deals with artificial intelligence and MIT but he talks so slowly and monotonely, like I got to turn up like twice the speed. So it's he sounds like a normal person. But I digress. It's a great conversation. But people like that that, you know, he's not he's not doing tours, he's not, you know, selling it. He's he's just telling his story and it's hard to discount, you know, people like that, whereas you know someone that seems to have some strife and government and then they leave and then there's some weird things going on there, like the Luis Alsando. You know, I don't know. I mean how much of that could be a cover story that, because we know that you don't just quit the Pentagon because you're not happy that they're not releasing ufo stuff. And then just go start leaking into the former rocks are guitar player from link on hundred and eighty two and put it on Youtube. I mean, what's noted? Did that? He has to live with Putin and Russia, right. I just know that we are...

...familiar. We know that operation mocking bird where the CIA was going to infiltrate our media. And what how many media companies are there? There's like six people basically the run all the media in the country. Yeah, and so it's very easy really, if you want to get everyone on board. If you look, and I've been going through, I've been listening to the dark journalist, and I think everyone should listen to this guy. Take it with a grain of salt, make your own conclusions, but he definitely believes that this is just a ploy to increase the size of the military. And if he's right about this, though, all the new articles that are coming out from mainstream media are about our UFO's a threat. Is this the national security threat? And they're using eleven style language to describe the UFOS. One we don't really know. We know the UFO has been around since like the forties and don't really know them attacking us or taking down jetliners. So why is this all this threat language being thrown around now? Marko Rubio's using threat language because of what they do there. Where do they go? They're always an the military. Yeah, well, also at at the same time, I'll I'll give you another angle on this too, particularly in the last couple of years. If you're familiar with you know, social media and how thing. So I mean to social media, just the media complexes and everything else. What what makes the money? Clicks? Yeah, right, the bigger the grand the more salacious the headline, the more clicks you get. And you have. Oh, should be solacious enough, you would think. I'm honestly bored people blaming the media. Just watch something different. If it bothers you, well, yeah, know, it's I don't think it initially bothers people. It's you have a choice. Yeah, well, that and the people get caught up it. It's fear and selaciousness and a lot of people don't realize, you know, what it's doing to them and what they're getting sucked in. You know, I'm I'm guilty of it myself, even though I am aware of you know, being on social media and scrolling and you just being sucked into it. I still do it, you know, it's I get much better at it now, but if you, if anybody is familiar with you know, you go online on twitter, whatever it is out there, there is so much like anger and frustration and just hatred and people are just back and forth to screaming at each other all the time. Well right, let's exists. Most of for something. Some of my thinker people ire is a full room of people in Saudi Arabia just, you know, with thirty different accounts trying to spread popaganda. All for sure. You know, I think people get sucked into it and all these, I think a lot of mean cups are just trying to get clicks. So they're trying to you know. But I think there is some kind of driving force of you know, fear and sex cells. My psays everybody, and I think a lot of people internalized. Don't trust the news, don't trust then and don't trust Fox News, which is good. You don't trust the government, but that doesn't mean trust the dude on Youtube. Oh yeah, the only thing this is especially the last couple of years in the stark for last yeah, I will purposely if I find someone new to follow or if I find, like you know, a journalist or a news outlet, I will purposely find an opposite opinion of them. I do that too and follow them as well. We might be done with people that. We don't need to it. What you need to do is find the original source. That's all you ever have to do. But they mean every case the original source is a former counterintelligence agent whose dad was in the CIA, who is telling us that he quit the Pentagon because he was unhappy about disclosure and is now the mouthpiece for leaking it. So I'm right, but it's just my cousins with a bone to grind. You think they're going to have any more information than that? I mean, how much know? How we know this is not a cover story? We don't. We have to be comfortable with that. You know? Yay, yeah, you we don't. You know, and that's that's the thing you look at. All Right, the best thing we can do is look at all the options. You know, like we've discussed. All right, well, we don't think it's other countries, we don't think it says, we don't think it's that. These are the top ones we're looking at. And then all you can do is sit there and go, okay, I think it's either the governments trying to scare us, it's extraterrestrials. It's alterraterrestrials, it's this, it's that. What is it? Man? I would you guys saw him, he was, take the knowledge you have and go from there. Like to read you guys something about why I just can't get on board with worrying about whether or not the sea's tricking us with CGI or whatever. It's like if you go back to one thousand nine hundred and eighty nine, you know, like these videos aren't fake. You are witnessing these and I back in nine today, nine the Belgian military. There's this triangle, isn't it? As it started in ninety eight, nineteen eighty nine, with the early s and what these things were. They were going from...

...a hundred feet above the ground to a hundred and ten thousand feet about the ground in your seconds, then back down to higred feet, then going off of radar because they're going so low. They're being chased by Fens, by helicopters, the Belgian military. There's interviews out there and they're moving in ways that would like literally melt things that we own, like the things that we make. Wow, and this is nineteen eighty nine. China wasn't doing that Shit in nineteen eighty nine, you know, like Russia wasn't doing that. Russia was collapsing in China was cross whatever. Peoples Dason yeah, Tenement Square and had a army that was probably most their air force, and stuff was from the S and s s of the time. Right now, I think, like I've been saying the whole time, you have it was are real. I'm just afraid that now the mouthpieces and are the people that were lying to us the whole time about it. How do we know that they're not going to play on this and use it for their advantage? I think your point is noted, but like, let's wait till they do it. Then, like let's talk about the OPOS. Okay. Well, let me ask you guys this. If you fos are real, do they have some kind of arrangement with the government? I mean, like, why do we have to let them drop this? Like why don't they just go totally around our petty Earth Wing governments and go straight to the people or announce their presence that way? You sound like an alien. You you there has been some of that. Yeah, you guys, reailier, with the the interaction that was recorded with the school children in Africa. Yes, that's probably Zimbabway that John Mac recorded. Can you tell us about it, though? I mean I don't know. I all I know is from what I recall. I don't know that much details about it, but there was right. I wish I remember the year up top of my head. I don't have I don't remember the years in this late S, early S, I believe. Yeah, it was. It was well over twenty years ago, because they're there. The story is that this UFO, whatever it is, landed in front of this this school yard of Children Africa and an actual being came out and, you know, interacted with these children and they went. Happened, I think these are just hitting bullet points here, is that these kids drew pictures of what they saw and whatnot, and then there was a there. I think there's actually a documentary. It'd be cool to for good look that up. There's a docuary that that came out. It was like twenty years after this, where they brought a bunch of these kids back together and to kind of talk about it, and it was, you know, they they all told the same story. They still they still tell the same story. They say, you know, they say that was burnt and our brains. It was, and it's it's still the exact same and it's it's fascinating. I have no idea what happened, you know, but it's pretty incredible. I think. I think a lot of our stories from this. You know, people have been telling ufo stories forever. For Yeah, for sure, literally forever. I mean even if you, if you watch ancient aliens, the show, you know, apparently they built the pyramids and whatnot, but that's a little out there. But yeah, but if, yeah, it is, the military has the equipment to see these things much more readily and they're out there much, you know, more frequently and much higher volumes than the people are. So they're in and that's and that's kind of the funny thing. We bring this, you know, full circle again, is people are now starting to believe in this more because the government said, hey, this is a real thing. But the whole time the government's always said anybody who see you UFOS are crazy and they're not a real thing. So we're and then like how many people have it's a weird conundrum that how many people you talk to the really trust the government, whether they be Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, God below got to be an all time low with people, everybody, any party's government, and for good reason, you know. But and then now, all of a sudden it's like, Oh, well, the government said it's true, so must be true. Yeah. Well, for people like me and and I've had, you know, off recording conversations with rick like and someone who hasn't trusted the government, meant for over twenty years, it's nice to be joined by everybody else. But like, that doesn't mean that I can't trust anything. Ever, like if you just always say, well, no, it's the CIA. Oh No, it's to say no, it's to say I can't believe anything like that's a stupid way to live life. But I feel the government only just only talks about things they absolutely have to. So something is forcing their hand with this, and that's that's the only and I think it's the fact that everyone has cell phones and a bunch of disgruntled sailors and airmen that are leaking video because no one is taking this seriously and they're sick of being swarmed like this. The ALMAHA thing. It took over three days in two thousand and Nineteen July, fifteen, sixteen and seventeen, west of San Diego. They were swarmed by hundreds of them...

...self, illuminated, really lit like, if you if you listen to the video Jeremy Corbell and George Napton interview talking about his latest drop, and doesn't say it, but it almost sounds like he's saying like the sailors and stuff were like almost dazzled by the lights, like they didn't even jump to their attack footing, like they were just kind of like watching, like it's scary. I'm sure there was and one of the one more point they had, he said, according to Jeremy Corbell, there was one UFO, you ap whatever, doing the whole I have God, thing like above all the ships, and then the other ships were swarming them and almost playing, like bouncing up and down through the water, jumping around, just having fun, like taunting up to nine kick ass navy battleships. And so you also have to consider too, I think, one of the key things to remember when you're thinking about these. So we've established that we don't understand how they work. So you also also have to remember when you're thinking about these things, is you. It's really hard to do, but you have to remember. They okay, if we don't understand what these things are and how they work, then we have to try to not put our, you know, our brains and how we think things should act and what things do. That's a good point onto them, you know, because it sounds like it is like, Oh, a mommy kitten was sitting in the sky and all heard little baby kittens were planning. You know, they're just out there having fun. Or maybe it was a Holograph, because maybe not, you know, meant messily a holograph. But we've talked about gravitational forces and you know gravity Ben's light. Well, so that's charge what I say that to those Rs. Our Air Force will have someone up above watching all the fighters go down. You know, I mean that's I think that's what scared the military. So it's more like a military or at least military people would perceive that is they could recognize that tactic. Yeah, time they can recognize that. They can't do anything about it. Yeah, so it's like whatever. So here we go. You're give me a good segue. Fred and I want to hear what you think about this. So, because rix question is, if u falls are real door, they have some kind of arrangement the government, why not go around them and announce their present? And I said, maybe the aliens don't want to talk at all at all. So it's not like there's a disclosure. They're the government's helpless. These things won't respond. Or maybe this is them talking. Yeah, you know, I think so. Let's for a moment cast everything aside and assume that these are products of intelligent beings in some way, shape or for I'm kind of lean if that is the case. I typically kind of in my mind, lean towards that they're more like a drone type deal, you know, kind of you know, we just sent, you know, machines to Mars. Yeah, I think that would be the most likely scenario if we consider that if they kind of end up like us in some kind of evolutionary chain, we're going to send drones and things to, you know, survey and watch. So if it is an intelligent being, you know, they might not want to, you know, necessarily contact us, but maybe they. I think one of the biggest factors in this is, you know, when you consider the stories around the nuclear facilities, the latch sites, that where they were shut down, that's really just a story to there's been what like, I think like three or four just cases of that happening, you know, and I think that's a very strong case for they are observing us. If this is a you know, an intelligent being, then maybe it's they're being insert observed or we be it. We are being observed rather kind of like a little science project. Or maybe they just found US sense like, Oh, look at these, look at these cute little apes. They finally learned how to talk, they started making computers. Oh Shit, they figure out how to harness the power of the atom. We Better Watch these ones, you know. I mean so maybe it's they don't want to interrupt too much, but they still want to make sure that these weird ants calling around the ground, they figured out how to harness the power of the atom, don't blow everything up. You know, I think it's a good it's good to kind of pull ourselves out of our normal thinking in the way that, like when you would we consider as we're walking around and you see, I got nature, see these ants on the ground. Well, we don't like maybe maybe some people try to talk to ants. I don't know. Never know, but if nothing else, like we as humans, we observe them. Well, he study them, I mean fully you out of that look at them and make you think, even strangers, that maybe the aliens notice that there's lots of attention paid to...

...nuclear sights and so, instead of being a benevolent force trying to get the attention of with they assume are the most powerful people in the government. That's why they shut him down, like they may not care about us at all or care about a awesome story in ourselves. But what I like about what Fred is saying to it like we can't even put human motivation on what they're doing. But it is curious on what you're saying is that it's they're not showing up at like shoe stores right, they're showing up at nuclear sites in submarines, so they know what they're doing. That's what lends credence to that. It's a military thing. But one of my favorite things about you AP theorycom you know, check it out and all these videos. It's like I feel like for the first time ever, we kind of have our hands a little bit on it. And so it's like, you know, because you're talking about aliens feeling us like ants, and that's kind of always what I thought. But now, looking at those things, they're ahead of us. But are they like a thousand years ahead of us, or maybe like five hundred years ahead of us? You know, like we? I think we could rally, I think we could figure something out if we really had a go toetote with these guys. We've seen their technology change, right. I mean it looks like they've changed since we started observing them in the modern sense in the S and S. Yeah, there now it does seem like there's always been like the acorn shape, the cigar shape and the triangle shape. What they do. It does seem like they're progressing on the same timeline as us, like they are changing a bit. Let me got go ahead for it. I was just saying, you know, it's impossible. You you made a really good point. It's to I don't think, obviously through any experiment of thought. You know I'm a real big thought experiment fan, but to just put our human thought process and knowledge on to a theoretical extraterrestrial highly intelligent being how they would act, would be kind of folly of us. Obviously we want to do that for one of the experiments Earth, you know, thoughts, but we really have to try to break out of what we know to understand what we don't know. Yeah, and and also, who's to say that just the way that like certain worms under the ocean evolved use thermal events as their source of life instead of solar so they're much better at that so of living than we are? Maybe this group evolved the gravity, you know, figured out gravity propulsion and faster than light travel or whatever they're doing to get here. But are like idiot. That everything else you know we don't actually know. Another like Bill Gates is like they're really smart, but you're a social idiots. By all counts he is. That's what people say. That then the parties with him and stuff like ends up yelling at people. Apparently his well degrees. Yeah, I was going to say I I naturally resist a lot of conspiracy theories just because over time most of them are wrong, and I naturally I resist a lot of build gates stuff. But he's not helping his case. I mean he is not. Might be a social idiot, although he might be in the rest divorce of all times. I got two more questions I want to try to get to. For Shit, you guys hanging on. So this one is one of the ones is more interesting to me and I'm going back to my you know, kind of conspiracy thing. But like if the government was gonna manipulate or control any messages from aliens, what do you think that would sound like, if the government was manipulating what the aliens had to say to us? Is this all like? I think it's like, you know, like what if, in this report or the months falling out, they're like, you know, we're in contact with a race of aliens and they're very concerned about earth and they want to make sure that you keep obeying your local ordinances and the government and keep enjoying consumerism, and there are actually sponsored by, you know, like major corporations or let stuff is a stupid I laugh at how ridiculously stupid that sounds, but that's probably exactly how it would come out to be. Like, Hey, guys, so turns out on June twenty five they say aliens are real and they think you should mask up and get vaccinated. They just got to keep on preaching the same style and I'm not. I'm not anti vaxxer or anti mask or just that you know, understand that there's a can just say sowing the line and towing the line. Yeah, it wouldn't be anything we're talking about. I would imagine that all kid in the side. They would say some of like, you know, we're in content aliens, like they don't want to change any of our governmental structure. Sure, like all of the authority that we have in place will stay in place as we start to communicate with them, or like they would make sure to protect their own. Their only demand is to raise the congressional salary. That's fire, but we're going with it so that we are grossly underpaid now. But you I don't know that. It's a really weird that's a that's a hard thing...

...to think about because you know what would happen. I think it's important to think about, though, because I do think that the temptation, if they are going through the government, which it kind of seems like they are. They're the ones that have hidden it and released it. If there was any contact to be made, who do you imagine that like the disclosure, the actual like hand shaking with the alien and the talking would be through. Let me answer that question by not answering that question at all. So the reason the government keeps popping up? The aliens aren't talking to the government. They're not talking to anybody. The government's the one that has a billion dollars to spend on censors. That's why you're the government's involved. That's it. And the whole idea that islands are going to come down like, oh no, guys, you gotta have peace and Stop War and climbal change and all that. They don't give a shit. Like they're going to come to the this random country or globe in the middle of the outskirts of the Milky Way galaxy that no one goes to because no one lives there, like, oh, we're really concerned, you're litting your ocean, like. I don't buy it at all. If they're here at all, it's either just straight up observing and like taking samples of Shit, or they probably live under the ocean suwhere now, or they're just here because a DOLF's called them to get the dolphins on the planet. That some dolphins. Yeah, you know, I think. I think for the most part, I I agree with Dan. I think I don't think they're necessarily communicating with the government. I think it's just because they have more equipment and they have more people out there. It's just a unified group of people that, you know, have to collect reports and you know military is is very good about collecting reports and whatnot. Well, don't you think it's kind of strange? Rudd and the other countries of experience this like, but no other country is really come out and disclosed everything. Italy has really put out a lot. We really listen to it. Well, I think there was a point to going back to the government is I think a lot of it is. I think maybe this is this is given the government of a boat on this one. Is they realized if this is what we're in this in my mind, we're pretending this is extraterrestrials at this with this conversation, you know, they realize that this is a highly advanced species that can do that. He you at least, can create machines that do things that we don't understand, and so we don't understand them. So we're just going to keep quiet about it because we don't want to pretend like that were inept at protecting her people. You know, I think that is one ballad kind of topic, discussion point for why they government would keep these things. And if you haven't noticed, since early two thousand and twenty, people freak out when they think they're trouble. Yeah, my things a full of gaslyness. I still have a toilet paper from but here's the thought that just occurred to me, and it's an original thought. Like even Lewis Elsando talked about how, like he claims that they have got rereckage and they looked into it and there's biological data on the wreckage. See, not bodies, but biological data. So people have interpreted that that means there's like alien fingerprints of some kind, as in like DNA or something. What if it's just like a slime or something, that it's somehow controlling these crazy what the drones are? The you of are the aliens, and like we just can't even begin to talk to these things. They seem like they're just wreckage. was like a little bit of biological life in it. Yeah, I mean, I really crazy. A new one and for you maybe it's just our maybe so, if we keep going down the timeline that we are with castilian aside, right now with technology, and a few fifty Hundred Years Elon Musk gets his neural link to work and then we start being, you know, symbiotic with technology. And then two hundred years after that the AI takes over. It plays out the whole horror film of you know, machines taking over, and then they create more ai and machines. And maybe that's all it is. Maybe it's just such an advanced technology that's it's just artificial intelligence. It's just floating around and we have no idea how to talk to it. That's a new one, right, especially like that one. The nearest like cabitable galaxy or planet is like fifty light years away. Maybe these are just like semi alive, semi autonomous drones that have just been flying for thousands of years that ended up here and can't ever report back. They're just broken freaking probes and we're af Ra out about them. Well, yeah, and if not, I mean at least the what they have going on, with the physics that allows them to do what they can do. You know, we talked about light and gravity and if they are using some kind of gravity as a force to move, will gravity and light don't mix well, together, and so maybe we don't even know what they actually look like us. We're just saying the light refracted or, you know, bending around these objects and weird...

...ways that we don't understand. Well, that's a very good point in a very good question, because I've heard some other people talk about that. So the RY. Why can't we get any clear pictures that really show the structure that aren't distorted, of these craft? And is it are of their own phenomena that we can't see them like that, or is it something that like they're purposely only releasing the photos that are thermal scans or night vision or whatnot, you know, and it's we you mentioned. I'm a pick a bone real quick. You mentioned neal degrass Tyson earlier and I said, like, I really appreciate some of the stuff he does, but one of his biggest things is well, we have all these these high tech cameras. Every everybody has a high resolution camera in their pocket. Well, coming from a scientist, that sounds a little bit ridiculous because if it's technology we don't understand, how can we for a fact say that we understand that people should be able to take pictures of them? You know when, and especially if you ever look at, you know, pictures from satellites or, you know, the Hubble telescope or these things are out in the space. When you when you see these pictures of space, that's not what the picture looks like right now. They have to do a lot to or don't them? Yeah, they say they do a bunch of editing to make it appealing. Like if you follow, you know, Nas ar something like that on Instagram, those pictures that they're showing you, those aren't the actual pictures. I try to zoom in on a bird with my iphone and take a picture and it looks like I took a picture like underwater, like our phones, artist for band balloon. Now there's just a bird, like there's a cool Hawkun like a telephone or and I try to zoo and take a picture and like it was a four pixel picture, like these phones really aren't that good. Someone them are to say that you you can take a video or a picture of a you know, quote unquote, extraterrestrial, you AP or Ufo that has some kind that has this technology that allows to do these wild things that we don't understand. That's a mile too miles three amount, whatever it is, a way on your camera phone. That's I think it's a little Distantang and then you got to upload it at the highest quality, and you too has to upload it at the highest quality. Like there's so many, you know, something that's really into big foot, to which I've realized. To It, I've realized either big foot our UFOS are going to be real and they can't both be real. And makes me sad waiting for the ghost too, Scholis, to come out, because I think that was way be real. But like, it's really there's so many artifacts in any type of digital video that you never going to get a crystal clear unless it's literally like, you know, a really good navy camera or something. And also, to that point, is, if I were to see so I've I'll be the first to say I love the thought of, you know, extraterrestrials or whatever it is, or you know, weird phenomenal like I love it's an it's fun, but I've never had like a ghost experience or a big foot experience. You know, I'm I'm a hunter. I've spent hours upon hours upon hours out in the woods and when he gets dark and you're in a weird woods. I understand how people could get freaked out a little bit because I've been places where it's like, Oh, this is weird, even though I know the area. But you know, to think, if I were to see something like a ufo, I am not pulling out my phone and taking a picture. I mean, maybe because I'm a little older than most, like I'm also not the person that sit to the concert and records, records the the live concert on their phone either. Right, like you're seeing something that is blowing your mind, most people aren't going to pull their phones out take video of it. They're going to go, Holy Hell, what is that? Yeah, and they're gonna be frozen, and then it's going to be gone here and go, Oh, I should have pulled my phone out. Yeah, I feel like I would for sure pull it out, but I don't know that I would actually film it, like I think I'd be looking with my eyes and trying to record at the same time, like that's that's why I give a lot of leeway to these bad videos or, like I saw a really good one recently. I came from Indonesia, and we should put the link of the website because there's some good ones and like as the guys filming it, like the camera just slowly drips away and it was like his sed off, like that's not real, like no, that's the most real because he's watching with his eyes. He forgets to hold it with his hand. I for sure believe that their stuff out there and that they're view of those are real. I just also for sure believe that we're going to get played or the government's going to try to use it to their advantage. Well, all agree with you there. If it's just like the saying, you know, never let a good catashra be go to waste. Actually, they're going to anybody. I mean not just the government, most, maybe not most people, but most people that would be involved in government workings are going to take advantage of of certain situations. I said this Jeremy Corpbell Guy, the way he's he'll hint at the videos, come in and hype it up, then drop it and then a month later do another one. It's really freaking annoying. But I also can't blame the guy for trying to like make his name and make him buck off of it like that doesn't make it a yeah,...

...like if I were making money off of it like it's you have good will. Because that's the weird thing, though, because they're not making money off of it. That to the stars academy is like fifty million dollars in that jerk orbell is not. To the arts of Kenny, I know an interesting thing about them. You want to talk about them as they've gotten dark like a year. But yeah, I'm not super familiar with them, but I know Jeremy Corbell has done some, you know, documentaries and stuff. He's making money. That's how it makes money's his names out there. Everybody knows the name. So there's a lot of different ways to make money. Yeah, and as much as I like that guy and as much as I appreciate what he says, he's trying to do. I don't know if you ever, and speaking of some people people hate, have you ever watched the interview with Joe Rogan and Bob Lazar, since throw on the topic? Yes, it had drink Jeremy Corbell there with them. Yeah, it's like the whole time he just made me laugh, like all right, here you have a Guy Bob Lazar, who, if he doesn't know about him, that's really interesting too. That supposedly he was working on a UFO. Do think he's some reserves? Now that's propulsion system. Yeah, we know now. Yeah, but it was funny that, you know, with Jeremy Corbell was there. He's a Bob Bob. Come on, tell him the story, Bob Tek, like it's like you can tell, like Jeremy Corbell is the media guy. He's the guy that wants to like him, to hype it. U's really it's so real. It is not. I now, and I'll be honest, I like Jeremy Corbell just as much as I also am annoyed by him. Like he wrote, he's a very imbrasive personality. Yeah, that's a good word for it. And, like George Nap, I like him, want to, but he's also the coast to coast. Like the CIA has a trek record of using people like this, going back to operation mocking bird. I think they decided that it makes it works for the American populist, especially in this day and Kardashian age that we're in, where it's like we need the instagram guy to get this to the populas. You know what I mean? Like even going back to the S, who knows if it's true or not, but the guy that invented the gong show and he wrote the Song Pali State Park. They did a whole movie about it and he was a Cias if they're always like finding smart people that they have dirt on. What was it like the Church Commission, where they came out and said without saying like they were the centators are asking them like how many people? Do you have any employee people from the CIA that are working the media? Like yes, they do, yeah, but in TV, have it in radio and and I's a real thing. And I'm not claiming anything about Jeremy Corbell or George NAP, I don't know. But just if you were the CIA, you'd want some approachable and it would definitely be a bonus if you had some insane blackmail on them and say you are going to release these videos and do as we say, or insane. buttmails coming out and again nothing do with them, just from reading about like again the guy from the Gong show and all that stuff like, and it's also very true to say that if the government didn't want any of these videos getting out, the people that are releasing them went either a not have access to him or be we go commit suicide somewhere. Yeah, unders think happened. Just how many of these videos? Yeah, exactly how many of these videos, including the most recent one, are taken on board American military equipment and everything is conveniently blurred out except for what they want you to see, like these things are going through the proper channels. Yeah, yeah, yeah, well, that's when they're they're verifying. I mean I think, I think the important piece of you know, obviously we've I know your guys is kind of theme is the truly weird to you know, true crime and whatnot. But I think this is an important topic that you know, there are a lot of conspiracies around it, and I'm not saying any of my wrong by you know, who knows, I could. It seems like the government and different people surprise me every day. But I think the the ultimate, like underlying thing here is, you know, for years and years and years everyone said if you believe in aliens, are crazy. Yes, but just unjust knowing understanding the fact that there are billions and billions of stars in a galaxy, in their billions and billions and billions of galaxies in the universe and infinite come out. It's kind of hard to believe that there's not some some kind of other life out there. You know, I understand that. You know there's whether you're, you know, ultrual religious, and I don't say that like mockingly, but just you know they're because I am very familiar with that. I had a time pair when I was younger that you know, I grew up in Bible believing kind of church, and you know, it was the earth is six thousand years old and that's it. That's when God created. All right, I get it. But if, if he created the entire universe and the only life that he created is on this planet, it's a lot of wasted energy. Well, I'm a Bible believer there and I would consider myself a creationist. I don't find anywhere in the Bible where it tells you that...

...the earth has to be six thousand years old. I don't know where they really get that from. Other I guess they're going through genealogy. But the whole garden to eating parts conservative the shortest time for yeah, it is interesting. Like Bible believers that believe it, and you if you read the Garden Story With Adam and Eve or whatever like. How were you want to take that? I know some people take it as allegorical. There is no time frame. They're like death didn't even exist in that so the earth could have been billions of years old while they were in there. But I don't want to get off on that whole topic, but I get us off. So scientists now estimate there are six billion habitable earth like planets in our galaxy and the earth is not even considered the most habitable earth like planet in our galaxy. Different planets that these guys definitely could be coming from within fifteen million light years, which is around the corner, they say. I do want to talk about the theory of evolution and the anybody that seriously studies it says how rare it is for life to evolve. I mean, we don't know. We might be the only planet, even if there are billions of planets where life is evolved, and then conscious life and intelligent life is even rare. I mean it's rare on our planet. I do they say that because I don't think anyone has enough of a data set to say that, because we've really liked that one planet. Yeah, I think there are. There are plenty of scientists out there that believe that we are the only ones because it's so rare. But when you in my mind, you you're talking about billiant once again, billions of billions of planets that could have it and have it life and galaxy, and then billions of galaxies on top of that, like, I think it's a little at least this this is where my beliefs come in. I think it's a little egotistical to think that we are the only ones out there. That, like, are we really that special? Yeah, when you look at the the statistics and the math of at all, like man, that's maybe, and it's in the fundamental nature of the scientific method says that you could know. True scientists, in my opinion, would state evolution is difficult because we've only ever seen earth like there's we know that there's too many universes, too big. I'm not saying it's not true, but no one can say that because you'd have to go to all the other planets. Don't we haven't done that, and then you can get into a whole other part that like it's consciousness or intelligence really necessary? Is that? Are we like a weird artifact of like a wrong in turn on evolution that created intelligence. I mean, like it's not really super necessary for reproduction. You know, the secret is everything has conscious and we're just murdering bugs all the time. Maybe. Well, there's that argument as well too. So I mean I don't know, but it's a defends how you define consciousness. Just can't hear the grass screen when you cut it, I would say. Well then, I think most scientists would agree, though, that. Yeah, it's incredibly rare. For Yeah, you know, it in time about anything with Fred. I like this. Yeah, because we can talk about how grass releases paramoument like it's fun. Hey. Well, I mean it's. Science has proven that like different types of fungus allowed like trees to communicate. Yeah, you know, so there's some weird things that go on there. I always I always like the kind of the thought experiment or analogy of you know, the aunt is a kind of a twodimensional kind of creature insects from from our understanding. You know, an aunt on the floor doesn't realize what's on the shelves in the room. So who's to say that we aren't an aunt on some floor that doesn't realize that there is this other dimension and you know, people think dimension, they think like the twilight zone, a different like all this, you know whatever woo woo stuff. Well, just a dimension is just another section of the world we live in. So, you know, we live in a threedimensional world. We understand that, but what's to say there's not a fourth or fifth dimension that we just can't perceive? The Angel Irish that they talked about the fairy mounds and they call them basically they kind of like siths or whatever. Hopefully I'm talking about, and also it's mirrored in them. The southwest, the native Americans also had basically kind of like fairy mounds and they said the people that live in these mounds walk among us all the time. They're just in a different plane. Basically, there's plenty of medieval myths to about. Flame they called it, which means dimension that was above us where things would drop in and out, and that was common throughout the Middle Ages. So I would like to do probably our next episode, get into some of the interdimensional aspect of aliens and and talk about that, you know, because I I think real quick. I think that's another that's that's on the top of my viable options for what these things are absolutely I mean part particularly, would you consider how we've discussed gravity, because gravity and time are interlinked and if you can manipulate gravity, then...

...possible you can manipulate time. So theoretically you could manipulate the the dimension that you are existing in at that point in time. Can I give you a real quick hot list, both of you guys, of viable options and see what you guys say? So, yeah, I'll say the viable option that you just said, the viable option of, you know, outer space, ultratrestrials, maybe us from the future, but then maybe some of these advanced life forms, like we said Dolphins. Some people say octopus are baby. Well, maybe it is these trees with these mass like fungal roots that are like a giant brain that's been in the earth. You know, include trees. We have to include maybe it's just the government doing CGIS. We can include that. Yet confusing you to you throw project Blue Beam on me. Yeah, but you said just as likely as trees flying ufos. I mean, I will this is what what is it? That's it just keeps coming back that what the hell is happening? I think we all agree that there's just so much that we don't know. I mean there's so much demon know. Those said, yeah, well, I think that is included under interdimensional and it's something that I definitely kind of think maybe some of the real ones are where like to explore more, but we just don't know. Like you know, like do you can have the argument that we can't appreciate intelligent life on our planet. I mean, I think it we'd all agree here we were probably the pinnacle of intelligence on our planet because we can articulate it, we can express I mean we don't see anything really from the animals, do we? Well, it's like going back to quotes you can attribute to people. There's supposedly an iound quote that said, you know, even the smartest fish in the world looks like an it did if you has to get to climb it up. Like yeah, what are we judging it based on? If these things are so foreign? They might be shouting at us all the time, saying please talk, and we just don't hear it. I mean, I guess you could use things like artistic expression, architecture, music. Some of the animals you can say, Oh, a bird has music, right, and we know that some elephants can Hainte by holding them Braj but monkeys are starting to use tools. When you look at humans as a whole, for better or for worse, you know, you can see the intelligence, you can see the intent, you can see thinking behind it. No, I mean it's a brainder that humans are everyone earth. I just I was given by the aliens. Yeah, you know, I'll say this. I attacking onto that and kind of going back to something how you started that out is I think our downfall is that we are just smart enough to forget that we don't know what we don't know. It's a really good point. Sorry, we often do that and then they puts us in the trap. I just and it's just interesting to like, what if whatever we're dealing with isn't really much different than us, but just is older than us. So like start because, like they say, humans have evolved for like sixty million years basically to get to where we're at. CEPHOPODS have evolved like three hundred and sixty six million years and they're probably below us, generous it is to say, right, like they're they're pretty smart. They're probably one of the next smartest things. So what if there's something that was the human speed of evolution, but that's three hundred million years old. Maybe that does explain I don't know. Maybe they they got the hell out of earth like when we were still swinging in trees. I just I do think that people that think they understand evolution, and I barely understand much science, SOM and put it out there, but it is incredibly rare even in our solar system or even in the universe, like we don't even understand apple genesis really how life comes from Nonlife, right, we don't understand what consciousness is. There's so many things at play right that we really couldn't expect to find it on most plants. Like we be astounded if we actually found like fun guy or something on a plan. Now, you're right it but within those strict parameters. What number did I just give? Six million? Five million? Within the strict parameters, there's like five million planets that meet or exceed those parameters. So yeah, but you're you're diluting your argument with an evolution argument, which we're not having. Everyone agrees that there's no other life on the sources. I'm so far that we know, unless there's microbial life on Mars, we're not talking about our sourcest I know I'm not even trying to argue evolution, to trying to argue the parameter. So, like just because it's life habitable, like it doesn't mean that life evolved there. So, like, out of that sheer number of planets that are maybe more favorable to life, we shouldn't...

...really expect to find life on most of them. This argument kind of presupposes we're not being visited by UFOS all the time. Boy, maybe we're not. Maybe that's a that's another thing out there. You maybe this is just a weird natural phenomena that's happening that we just can't explain. This is kind of a terrible analogy, but you know, back in the day people would see shooting stars. They think the stars are shooting across the sky, but oh it was just a chunk of space crap burning up in the atmosphere. You know, there may be some kind of weird you know, my problem is the intelligible phenomena, the intelligent movement, the way they sink up their movements with other ones. Some of the photos, I mean, if you really dig into it, some of the ones that have been released as that presentation to Congress from the you tip Tach Task Force, whatever you can see molded like metal and like structure and the light leaving off the metal of this like kind of aerodynamic six foots here, like they're real. Then they're made. They're not. They're not. You know, they only say like nature hates a straight line. They have straight lines, so they're definitely intelligently controlled. But Fred when you run, if you go all the way back to begin that thought, they have changed, like what people have been observing, like do you remember? Not that you remember, but like you remember reading about in the eighteen hundreds how there was like this airship craze and people were like spotting like airships, which seem to look more like wooden ships that were somehow floating, and like the whatever this thing is, whether it's a phenomena that we don't understand or it's from another planet, where like it seems like it's changed along with us. Yeah, I think maybe a little bit, but at the same time I think there's you could use that same argument to say, you know, an ancient hieroglyphs. There are things that seem to represent ufos and things that look like rocket ships and whatnot that you know, I think it's like it's it's fun to some of that falls on the Observer, doesn't it? Right? It's why the native Americans called the steam engine an iron horse. It's what you can refer to. Also, Badass way to describe as Devens also a good, good band, right, or something, I don't know. Yeah, so let's close it out, like final thoughts on this, and my final thought is just take what you're about to hear from the National Intelligence people with a grain of salt, because it will probably insert some stuff in that that's more self serving or be able to utilize it in a way that is not necessarily for our best interest. But I do think there's something out there. And what what it is? That no idea. My final thought is we're going to get a bunch of redactions, but it's also going to say something along the lines of, and you have to really parse the sentence, but was going to say this is technology currently don't have and we don't know that anyone else has it. That's all they're going to say. Yeah, and I will I'll say I agree with both of you on that and also, we know, I just like to ask questions. You know, so what are we looking at? Why? And continuing to try to understand what it is. You know, I fully think the government's of course they're going to use it for something, because that's what they do. But I think it's the thought process of you know, just because there is an evidence of of something doesn't mean that no evidence is is not evidence. Yeah, yes, maybe it's complating as that is, but the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. Yeah, yeah, so it's I think it's just something that you have to keep your mind open, because there's a lot of things that never made sense to us before they made sense now. And it doesn't mean we're at the pinnacle of genius there. We're going to learn more things all the time. So it'll be a will be interesting. It's throw ideas. Are Way I think of having open conversations and I really appreciate you guys having me on now. We were we were really happy that you joined us and thank you for coming here in questioning every little aspect of this whole UAP UFO phenomenon with us. Yeah, I think we figured it out. Maybe too, when you're ready to dig it out at the agent civilizations. Give me a call leaving dosy's on that too. Well, for Real, and I'm going to put this on here and hopefully this will stand the recorded episode. We have to do ancient civilizations and we have to have a round table. They send our religious upbringing backgrounds talk about why rick still thinks you ifos might be demons, and it's strong possibility...

...if the demon aliens will leave me alone if that wasn't the right so we'll talk about it. If you'd like to hear more from front, you can check out his show chronic curiosity. There are online at chronic curiositycom. They have a big footprint on Youtube as well. Check out their videos. Also be sure to check out www dot invisible ships podcastcom. We're going to put a lot of different links and we'll be linking to chronic curiosity over there as well, so it might be an easy way for you guys to find it. And in the meantime, make sure to subscribe if you are not a subscriber to the show already, and we will check you guys out later.

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