Invisible Ships podcast
Invisible Ships podcast

Episode · 8 months ago

Murder Lake update part 2

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In our second update on the Bryon Macron case, we talk to another listener/research team member named Scott. Scott has been doing a tremendous job looking at the surveillance video and other key pieces of evidence. He fills us in all of his discoveries. 

He has never said I never said yes timefor the invisible ships podcast were we talk about everything from true crimeto the truly weird invisiotion pocast. This is part to of the Makron caseupdate and we're going to be talking to Scott, who is somebody. That's beengoing through a lot of the video surveillance that was in the BCIRreport and thereis a ton of clips there, and it takes a long time to dig throughall of it. He's found some really interesting things, and so we're goingto reach out to him and have him describe them to you. I wanted to thankhim and everyone else that is given up their time and lent their expertise tothis case. You know there's a lot of areas where we don't know what we'redoing, and it is so cool that there's people out in the community that dohave the talent and do have the knowledge about certain areas and thatthey're willing to give up their time freely and help discover the truth,because that's what we're all after at the end of the day is we want to knowthe truth and we love crowd sourcing with you guys and relying on you tokind of help us reach the end, go which is going to be justice for the macronfamily so that, further to let's get into the report and talk to Scott, Hey Scott, this is rick. How you doinglike I said before. Scott is the main guy that we turn to for help with thevideo obits he's been painstakingly workin his way through the BCI file andexamining all the video that's in there. The majority of this comes fromsecurity cameras. It's a lot of work, we're hoping that it pays off big theanswer to what happened to Brian N Mackron could be found on you yeah. We can start with the videos, that's kind of where I started originally, you would, you know, startsending me the files through emails into the drive that point started goingdescrepanciesand through M, so I get my mind open once I got the original files,everything kind of started falling in place because I had tad camera twenty.The Second Angle, so I started at midnight basically, when the file startand workd my way pretty much all the way through the files, andit's Por, the PCI report, their heads, watsno other, you know,traffic in or out of the offices other than when Brian's vehicle shows up andwhen it leaves. I can fully confirm that I did not see any health wootraffic te. Other you know, vehicles coming in and out just say is the BCI file says this is where the first kind ofdescrepancy comes in. The BCA report states that the videoshows of the video tracking his vehicle coming West bound and turning into theoffices I found when I went into the clip, it's only a two second clip and it doesnot actually show him coming down the street. It alley shows him poiint intothe offices, so thatit's, the first one that caughtme off guard made a note, Abit n starting moving on. So I kind of get my im things didn'tsee much then I got to the six fourteen clips now when we originally startedlooking at Hem, it was kind of back and forth did really get the six fourteen cliton.A lot of it was paid attention to the six nineteen clip which always showedthe vehicle in the drypoint. Once I got Thad Second Camera Angle, Iwas actually able to go back start at the six fourteen clip and trasee viaclecoming west bound turning into the offices for pretty much an entire clip. It doessit in the trive way once that particular clip ends and theSID nineteen clip starts. It starts moving forward and if you know the office area by the thefront there with the maintenance department, there's a front gary in thefront where you can pretty much just turn straight around so he startsmoving forward and starts turning around and coming out. I was able to capture SOMMA still snapsof it. I can send those to you guys I CID post a couple of Themin the websocewebsite. It's pretty obvious from what I've seenthat will call mystery vehicle is an American oversized vehicle. The only thing I can actually pant tois a Ford Expedition, maybe a Ford...

...expersion, possibly Foren, fifty or NIVhundred and fifty with a cap on it or we can even go chevy suburban inomtimes,but it is big, it's boxing and just very distinguishable outside ofthe specifics toit. What color was it it's hard to say it is very dark, so Iwould either say black or dark gray from what I can tell of it, especiallywhen it come passes through the lights coming out in the drive really doesn'tchange much color, so it is a darker vehicle. Do you think it looks like thevehicle that was at the Midt Mart? I lool PERSONI would say no wanted in apart, which we can get intoa little bit. I have pretty much identified those two vihicles makebottles of them, plas, ed, that one out last night Iwent through a bunchof searches. Did you know Prpareahol and I've got thosetwo bagles down man, parer vecolar, basically, two thousand and twelve suber foresteriuritating yeur production and the other one, the silver one turned out tobe about it. Two Thousand and nine give Ertake Sheby, SIDIC Hatchneck, so yeah preparing a super foresur tothe full size vehicle that get the offices completely different. Ohdefinitely wewthis is where it gets in my kind of eyes. This is what reallyopened me up to it, and I I'llpost this question to youguys and everybody out there and I actually posted to Charlie Ci. Also when I talkd to him,which we'll get into in a little bit to sofor instance, you and your friend aretaken two separate vehicles and you're heading wherever and you know whereyou're going, but your friend does not know where you're going so you're inthe league, your friends behind you, you pull out something kind of holpsthem up in the backside. They don't pull out you now right away behind you. What is you as a lead? You know leadriver, but basically your first onsting slowdown Pullo over yeah and now Mike Yo were talking in the morning o R, whatever it was so as I start, Thi Nic Ninteen clip in thevehicle pulls around in cools out of the driveway and makes a right hand.Turn starts hitting ES PON ON HUNDRED NAN sixty two which wood road, as he pulls out its hazards, turn yeah ow. I followd this car. There isabout a one, an two second glitch once he starts going down the Road Hartsay how far down Theri Wuk Glitch, which I've kind of noticed throughoutall the videos, is kind of a weird part Os that, like I'm sorry top you, but isthat Clis, you think an artifect to the camera, it's hard to say because sometimes it'son camernineteen, and sometimes it's not at twenty. Sometimes it's on twenty,sometimes it's not at nineteen. I think it's just something with the emotion capture so to safe. Okay, O me,throw you off, keep going your you're fascinating, so you know he turns out it's itsflashers. I was able to follow him going down theroad, and even with that, little Glig you can distincti me tell it's still.The same vehicle hazards were left on from what might what I could tell andwhat I followed all the way down to the Halash road, which is bu about thousandmeet down from the offices. Now two minutes later now. That's the othergame hear it took him almost two minutes to go from the OFFIC's Duballish room at Thi time is he's making a great handtern onto bellish, and I did trackit from camera twenty. You can follow thehazards, making a right hand turn on Belch as he's turning that's whenBrian's vehicle exits, the office drive turns right, which wone hundred adsixty two is eas bound turns right on Dallas road, also exact same Ath. Nowmy question is I'm thinking in myhead. It is what kind of a coincidence. Is it atsix? Twenty in the morning years, last...

EA township Al Area really not muchgoing on deslit country roats such as bellish that two cars first car balling withyou know as or time with Ha. Second Deicul following the exacine PA, really raises some question in my head for sure, so you think Brian wasfollowing them. I think so or whoever was driving Ryan's car. Wecoun say that yeah, since we actually don't know my personal suspicion was,he was driving just from the pictures, the car and beside and just everything that was the waythey found the car in which I kind of explained to you one point: Iparticularly noticed the water bottle in the car and how it was kind ofsmashed over from the passenger side. So to me, in my personal opinion, Brianwas driving with whoever was with him, which we can read wiht back dhuring. Asecond was kind of you know, making sure a Hustaying a check so to say kind of leaving leaning over the Middle CousilHouse with water, allagats mashed mwhat. Do you think about the sea being pulledup really far when they found the car ithat one yeah that one clos my mind, you know just backtrackand. Ipersonally think he had somebody Inin the cart with him when he arrived anthe offices. That's my binion! That's just goingthrough everything that I've gone so far thin. So I think so. If we takethat theory into it, maybe somebody else was driving t sortof person. Possibly they would drop something andwas just picking out the car underneath the seat or something like that could be numerous differentpossibilities to it. You AR EALL SA There's a lot of head, scratchers yeahI mean- or I guess I mean I don't know smart. These killers are but like whydidn they just pull a see a just throw people off. I mean that's at least apossibility. Ou know yeah yeah a quite honestly, that's kind of what theopinion I'm getting is this? Wasn't you know no professional hit or somethingor nothing? They really didn't know what they were doing it was. It was a reaction. Thing isfrom one Owha, I'm getting seeing the evidence and everything it was. He wasattacked and it was a reactionary thing. Premeditated can't say for sure youknow whatever would not, but it wasn't no elaborate, tind out. Okay, this iswhat we're going to do. Hees our timemind Thi, er Goul. You know putthis here and do that here. It's too sloppy for that I've alwaysfelt whatever it is. It was an escalation that, whatever they had inmind, it wasn't supposed to end in death and it just kind of went that way,but we don't know I' Kin of think it was meant to be ascare TACTI yeahsideways. So, what's Charlie, did you tell Charlie aboutyour idea with the car? Yeh INDOF start that Ong off the other day when I was kind of afterI did through the videos and kind of found. What I found I put my kids to bit already, and youknow, is just kind of jomn out for the night kind of just going through beforeI fell aasleep. I said you know what I gotto do something, so I actuallycalled the O toline, and this was twet thirty, something like that Mi clocklater at night and the girl gets on the phone and youknow Tal Bout, a was like you know, I'mhelping out. You know these guys went to Bo podcast and N W. I found somestuff that I'd like to you know really a happy and I kind of start talling herabout the videos and that and she's like Whal, wait what what Y he's likeall right? Well, you know, what do you have the pase number and all that soyou know I gave er the case I earned Chare, you know name and all that S,like you know, Twat I got you know, took some notes down. I passe this ontohem, you know let thim know and see if you you know, had to give a call backor something or whatever difi emails everything it was Friday kind of Friday, so gin not Monday morning, Charlieactually does email me back so and actually I apologizeei eaimyfirsthe actually did call me back that Monday, an Nice Conversation for about fifteentwenty minutes with them Great Guy...

Belev. You know not byas not really pushed anyone way.He just wants to find the facts in the truth, and he find out told me that onthe phone he's like that was, my job is to find the truth, which he also did inform me, and thisis kind of were the roadblock they were going to be running into now. He did say to me that his investigation and the Ohio BCI wasstrictly to assist. They had no final saying the casewhatsoever. A solly fell on the Madona County, sheriffs department andProsecutor Toms. Did you get the impression it would have gone adifferent way if they had more say or Noyeai? Actually, I honestly believethat I've got numerous emails back and forth with Charlie. Now, just you knowgiving them stuff that I've been finding, and my full impression is those oting not rgone of his quot innow, which I believe I did Forwardyuri was. She has never said Suecide, yes, yeah.That was a big deal, wow and yeah that on when I read that one, you know rightoff the back. My head just kind of went stepp back and was like. I open her.Okay, now we're getting somewi he's saying t e more that he's saying bysaying that you know I mean Yehyep, no it'Si, meand, post and everything else,an you know. Everbody has their opinions of everything and everyonethat's being involved with this. After my communications, Charlie, isfully you know middle. He wants the truth andthat's how he flat up wit. Itto me. I want the truth for sure. I've always thought the BCI.You know they even said in the press conference. They were told to start thecase all over agan once they got it, but they were just given. They couldn'tchange the data they were given, Bylafiyett, so you're only as good asthe day that you have exactly yeah. Actually, I kind of mentione thattolike, you know thereis things at the time. You know we're talkingtwo housandand seventeen when a lot of this was going on Tlik. You know now that youknow we've had the podcast and people have kind of you know open up. You knowtheir minds to it, and you know, is a community we're kind of pullingtogether to kind of get our answers for this. You know, there's been a lot moreto come out than may have not been into consideration. Oh, I think definitelyand that's that was my purpose. I that's what I told Charlie that was mypurpose of contacting Yiu is what II Ye Wee Bun coveredmore? That was not fullyavailable at the time. So what what ID Charlie ofte otherdirection of where this could go is obviously there's a cover right. Sowhat Ad Char Tu about the video like? Did you show them? The video that yougot of the two cars leaving yep? I did well, I didn't send them to copis. Itold him the files he exact file names Om. Obviously they have the BCI filstillan. So I get a motefile names the times.Exactly what to look for the reply. Ye really gave me that was:is he got it reviewed it and was going to forward it the sheriffs andprosecutor times and which you pretty much said that toany of all the evidence that I've been you know, kind of email, O peseing toim is he's going to take it review it. An eyeah. Well he's really constrainedby what he can do EU so when you're going through it. How like are yougetting a lot of lapses in in the time of night, in those videos or not too many lapses, so to say, fnote there coul possibly be aclipperto missing out of them, because there are a couple time frames at don't matchup, as far is pretty much from the time.trame that he shows up to, he leaves is pretty straightforward. Uld Be flipkingbetween the two cameras. There really wasn't funch to Tis on er, so therewouldn't be a third. You don't think you could have. There could have been athird car squeezed in there, not unless they showed up beforemidnight or after you know the clips that were into the file aboutn. That,like I said the possibly could be a clipper to missing that might showsomething I can't say for sure...

...very much boat. I went do once I gotdone with the videos and pretty much determin that you know without a doubt.In my mind, there was the second will Bein OOne Po, that second hystryvehicle is fully involved with it. At that point, I kind of stepped away fromthe videos, and I started dabbling more into the files and that's when I started getting into fo regords. We G. that's when my mindyou know my eyesreally started brightening up a little bit ecause. I started seeing somethings: anthe, Morit kind of started toget inthe or it was kind of more eyeopening and at the same time was moreharepulling. If I had in mor to pull out he same time. Everybody knows this is Ntirightheada very busy. Life between Isyou know the jewelry businessand the trustees and his family, and you know everything else that you knowwas going in in his life. He was constantly on the because he always hadsomething going on. So it's I times it does get frustrating trying to sortthrough things and trying to push away what's perent. What's that Peri've beenreally pretty much all day, I been kickingmyself back and forth back and forth how far I wanted to go with this OneiGaine a conclusion: I'm not Gong to put Ames out. My main reason for that is. I do notwant to hinder Charlie or anybody hells that might possibly take this forward,respect that, but what I can say is I have tracked pretty much the last five numbers that were in contact before Yithe offices at two o'clock: DTO. SURPRISE: You, yes ill EA to deat, yes and OARE, some ofthe people, people that are close to him. I can say yes and pretty huch thing I'll say on that is at the sametime, I also listen to the audio interviews and what I can say from right here andwell beleave it in debt, because I think that's were Tou dropt when itcomes to that perprticular subject, somebody did not disclose everything and woll leave it at that. You know it was almost a moral tolomon.Now I'm thinking about this S, I on eaten. If names do come out, it's AU,factual, beast, but at the same time like I said thatiinhern investiation, I think what we're doing here is the proper way thatit should have been done. You know inpestigated to the point. You know hewea, but with what you guys have gone inwith what Paul is dning. What me and bunshing you know the facebook groupand thewit slu grew. I think we all can pretty much come outflat. I'm saying it was not a suicide. He was attacked, Yeah Yeah, that's Lik, NT, contracal Yeh. At that point you know you cankind of say it's branches off into to what we know and it kind of goes in different directions of which way Ou enpont. If it's in this point now, we've declared that you know there was asecond party. He was attacked that there's pro cause investigations.Also, we know Thi can go into an embarrassing side for the family. Sonow that we've you know established is this is where my moral dewema kind ofcomes in now that we've established all this. Would it not be ventorious decisionwhether to move forward or not pe imple factor? It could potentiallyuncover something embarrassing to the family or include potentially uncoversome kind of criminal activity? Well, I don't think anyone has a right tohinder a murder, invest iage. I think...

...that is beyond any one person exactly Imean Scott I'll. Tell you I talke to Victoria. I mean a couple times a week,pretty close to the since August dish, maybe September actually more likeSeptember, and she has stayed true to justice forBrian, so whatever IAEVEU but Yeahi, fully agree with you, you know, Ie hurther interviews and red Hem and everything and that's kind of where youknow one has been coming from is like Idon't know. If we should put, then yes is pretty much late, Ryou know whateveroyou know, and I'vehad to be honest with you like. It's not been aired, but I've had sometougher conversations with her about those things because trying to figureout, because that's mean that's so like when we open this whole thing. Iliterally thought we were going to be like summarizing news articles anddoing like a to three thing. Maybe we could SNIG somebody's interview, real,quick and call it a day kind of thing, and you know, and then we stagged allthis stuff and then BCI, you know released the whole things. It's beenthis like total different thing, where now we've kind of got like a lot ofstuff and some of the stuff you're right. It's it's not necessarily stuff. You wantlike in the limelight, but I will tell you that, first of all that I can haveher contact you if you'd like she has expressed gratitude for what all you'redoing. Oh Man Yeah huge gratitude she's, so I can definitely give her yourcontact, information and I'm sure she'll reach out to you at some pointbecause she's still going at it she's got the BS report to she's goingthrough it to she's fighting for this. Just like you are and just kind of likewhat we are too, you know with Onalli here to this Aristoleanprinciple of all the truth, wherever it least yeh her Tewe Din ot, that's kindof where right before you call at, I was kind of kicking in my head. Tos,like you know, were you know? Where do we really wantto go with this and then exactly? As you said, you know, Victoria can do youknow, and it was something I read yesterday. You know in the Bar Gor,where she pretty much saidt. You know, and I think it was down to the Tom townmeetings, so those phone numbers connect to like some of the websitesand stuff that we've gone across the actual phone numbers. I've actuallytracked for actual people. What there is couple weird ones in there and I was explainin this triceer Yeh youytalk about you- can talk about the numbers. You don't have to say all the time. I guess what they aresometimes related to, but explain what computer phone numbers look likeokaybasically what it is in between on the cologs there's certain. You knowyou can tell there's actual phone numbers and then there's iphone numbersI'm on ones. Yes, whatever you know, it's not it doesnat match up to a phonenumber and those are basically computer generated numbers now, there's tobasically two reasons that those will happen. One is the one thatticlar want if itstarts off with like one one: Zero, whatever whatever after I started, researching that thatpertains to a picture, timedia message that could not be formatted to thematicular phone who so see, for instance, if I'm e Cologitsaysn incoming call, is this one Hunde? No one to you know your phone number.That means you know you have a full. You know capable smartphone, butthey're, using a first generation, CLM sholit DIS, no aabilities whatsoever yeah. My brother did that for a longtime yeah I did e Tha is sometimesyou'l, get O othesame kind of see, quints of numbers whereill be like three one or differentrandom set of numbers. Now those anticker ones actually pertain to athird partyn on my messaging system, for instance, if youare using YounMessenger, a well messenger, facebook, messenger and you're trying to use thatto text tonot the facebook AP, but the Phon Itselfso. What Itt does is itTranslat from the Facebook Messenger Post translate that into ateexpassresince sending you know the...

...comueruer Tyou told me somethinginteresting, the other I think it was today or yesterday we were talking about how a phone without a SIM cardand get on Wifi and still capable of messaging, and that it creates numbersto sequences like that right, yeah, that's ex youave, no actof services ones do have wife. I bilitys den'tpenttheetethe Netso. These can be like what's APP or something like that. 'S JUST A littlemany tablet, bitt Persolni've, een, T S, do that all thetimeso tat'Si rl know,and so it's more common. I guess than we realize, after talking to you, thatyou know, there's different segments of the population that would be drawn tousing the phone that doesn't have a SIM card, that's using wify to contactpeople, and we can leave it at that, but that is an element in society thatis to this day. Doing that everydhing Usosrndwe can tell you know, I'm always impressed by talking to youhow much time and effort you put into pouring through that yeah you justlooking at Rodata and your you keep finding thise interesting stuff if youhavany real value to this case, especially with your conversations withCharlie. You know: That's very impressive, TAT'USTING! That's reallygood yeah, thanks for all your work, Goono Charlie, for reaching out soquickly too yeah yeah retect tarly to that was a very pleasant surprise ofMyper oimabeor Somethingi migh hear somethingyeah no Bhut. You know. I think that is anindication that he's interested in what you finding, which is good, becauseit's what we expect of our law enforcement is to be interested infinding the truth to a murder. I'm certainly interested yeah exactly well. She's been on this long enough now, man, wets Goy, the Tuth he wantshewants,Ui, famiy, Wanteverybo, Oyou, knowyou, know N. something like this does happen. Theright thingit! That's what we all want: Hey Scott!Thank you so much for your time and for all your work, Oni appreciate theGUYSIT's impressive. The interviews from both Bob and Scottwere packed with information, and we were just dying to have a chance tounpack it and kind of process what we just heard. So that's exactly whatwe're about to Dola guys reactions. You know, I think it dis just a lot to talkabout. You know so, first of all, where did Brian go when he first left hishouse? So you know we don't have any evidence ofwhere how he turned in to base off of Scotts interview into the Township Hallright a hopefully we get there when we get together and put together the video,but we don't know you, but right now that kind of makes sense with what I'vebeen thinking because of that Piing, which we're going to put on our websitedown there like Westfild Canar Road area, where it has a twenty fivehundred kilometer radius, r metertwenty me I mater e two hundred or twothousand five hundred meters. Yes, yes,...

...so that's less than three miles ifyou're keeping score ind home, which doesn't reach Chipal Lake does notreach the township hall and it's not in route of his house to the township hall.So why is this phone pinging down there? I you knon personally, I've done asmuch digging as I think I can get where it seems like he should have been inthat radius that there's not a reason that that would have come up, but yethe would have been somewhere else from what I think were understanding. But Ithink that's you know just kind of like you know: We've got a listeningaudience here. Somebody knows more about that. That can add clarity to it,I think, would be great, but as it saits right now, it' kind of looks likehe was down on the other side of Chipwall Lake, around n e Hondred andforty six am and then shown around the township hall on a differenttrangulation point. You know around one fifty am which isinteresting because there 'd be no reason to go down there unless you werepicking inoebody evor meeting somebod. Looking at the maps like if Bryan lefthis home and went to his office, which is by all accounts, the officialnarrative and most people haven't really raised any objection to it. There's the straight shot, there's thelong way, but none of those ways make sense with him being where he's at right. Right I mean that is not on theway to the office at all. Unless Yo's picking someone up meeting someone, thethe point, almost looks like because it's only four minutes from the nextpoint that he was probably traveling when he hit that now, why doesn't hisphone Ping before that? There's a gap? You know before that, so it's kind ofweird that it nothing pinged from his house to all the way on the other sideof Chipwall Lake, maybe put his SIM Cartin later into the run, could havedone that I mean could have the phone in Wifi or the phone could have beenoff. I don't know, but you know the main crooks of this episode and again,like we said we were Dune with Brimerican Wa to we had new evidence we're trying to UNPAC this, but we'reappealing to our audience, to especially the people out there thatare experts or have more knowledge than we do about triangulation and howsillier technology works, to help us out, because there's a lot of stuffthat we don't understand, we don't understand why the phone is silent fora long time. But what could cause that? Or you know somebody that knows moreabout how triangulation workswe're seeing some stuff that doesn't makesense. Do you any talks to me about thecalendar I'm going to post some of the picturesthat we have of it, but you think that maybe the Coulentar isn't quite what wethought it was so the Caentar entry in itself, which is the angry resumentright. It's the angry resident meeting. It's definitely odd, but some peoplewere sending us that they saw that that that calendar entry they thoughtwas created at nine. Twenty Two am on December, sixteen two thousand andsixteen a other said at four twenty two in the morning and then theywereapplying what they knew about UTC from the pings to subtract five hours andmake it be it four in the morning. If you look closely at that screenshot,which you can post the time that's shown, there is thetime that that image was created and to prove that you sculle down a little bit,and it says it's like six: Seventy one by six, seventy one, it's a fifty killbut file, it's clearly an image so that image was a screet shot that was madethe day that Bridan was discovered it. It would make sense for the cops to bemaking screenshots of his Coendar, so it makes sense for them to be making itand not so it's not unusual the time I don't think th the counters weird welland also what's unusual, is that they're taking if th, if that's trueand they're taking screen shots, why aren't they taking photos of his phonein the office again? That is very strange right. So ood point. Let me I wantto dive into that, so thatwas brought up by Bob, and that was one of the better. I can'tbelieve none of us can't thought of that. No one has told us that yet bobis a friond of the show for that and AFL fairness. Victoria has texted met,but I just haven't really brought it well. Victoriaever is the ultimate andAl Fairness to me, O Ben Thinking, that for a while Ogotta Sy Itaybut, so in all those BCI photos, there's nophoto of his cell phone at the scene where they claimed that they found itright. They claimed they found it there right, that's yeah, that's the story!We have to take their word for Te, Tok pictures of Duffel bags. They tookpictures of shelves, they took pictures of newspapers and blooprintings andArbis cam water bottles and jackets. They would you would take picture ofthe phone. I mean especially these days. A phone is almost more important than awaltor keys or anything LS Righti mean if Youre Investigao know that the dadof mine is in the phone of the victim right or the Phon of e. The perpetrator,like that's, where you're going to get...

...all of your data that you need, and Ijust awlver convict- and I just think it's so important in it. Remindeng meof an old story from Word War Two and me and Rick we're talking about it, Ol,that's they. So they went to one of the engineers in World War Two and SI LOKplanes. Look at all these planes that came back and like see all thi sdanageas all this damage and boldholes all round the cockpit a stuff- and theysaid you know, Mr Engineer, don't you think we should put more armor aroundthe cockpit and he said No. These are the plans that are coming back, theones that don't return must be getting shot everywhere else, so we have to putarmor on the wings. So long story short, it's you got to look for the thingsthat you don't see, just as much of the things you do see, so that is one that e're gonna have tochew on for a while, because that's odd, it's a great point, also just realquick, I don't know, but if I was in Engeer, I would know that the wingswere important, Yeah Yeah! Well, maybe he had both. You know.Well, aircraft technology is come a long way. Yeah ot theyre, really e wastalking about wings. These days you know so the other thing is is like.We know that multiple people were touching that phone before it wasreally checked into evidence. Right I mean that means. Yeah eay have dolevidence that suppors TAT Wecan. We don't, but I mean we had like modaabletrasties, allegedly touching allogiously, like we lave in the Feastairport, but you know so this. This phone almost seems like, as the thedetectives are showing up that it's just getting like passed around andhanded to almost I mean that's kind of like the vibe. I was getting from thethat's important that that's not in the BCI yeah and that's it's not there, noinference right and so in this day and age of you know, jocumentation and evidence being allimportant like. I have a hard time accepting anything now that I don'thave any photographic evidence of the phone actually being there, but thereis quite a bit of anecdolal evidence from lots of people that the Phun wasthere and it was basically unguarded that anyone and anyone anyone, aneverybody that walked in the office is free to touch it, examine it orpossibly alter it. And then you know the what Bob was talking about the MTPconnection to the FOLLN. I mean yeah, that's very interesting, so why wouldbrian need to download his phone he wouldn't or why would he need to backit up if he's going to kill himself? What time was that again, the MTP Idon't know, but it we're seeming to see it closer to like four in the morning.That's bout that, like around form four in the morning, which would be I don't know I mean how do you imagine just go along with the suicide he wentto his office approximtely to am: Did he not go there intentionally tocommis sucide at first and something happened within those two hours? Wherehe's like I'm about to kill myself I' better back up my phone, I mean there'sno way that I can make that make sense in my head. No, so let's jump the TATSHTUMPTOM! Why why someone where they would you know so I mean something on his phone like what did hehave on his phone? You know that was so important and theycouldn't well. They could erase it right yeah. Well, I mean there's theobvious: whatever the text was or whatever was that got him out of bedwe've speculated before that? Maybe Bryan was trying to expose somethingthat was going on at the town, Ship Hall that had photos or some kind ofevidence on his phone. That's it it's worth pointing out MTP STANDE for mediatransfer protocol. So it's the computer protocol. It transfers mediafilesmainly from android to Windows, founs and so android I thinkis what he had. Sowhat photos is, I think, is really the thing yeah and you know so I mean don't youthink, like going through some of thes stuff that it's like fairly tech likeit's not like. You know a dog you off the streetsgoing to like figure out how to pull photos off someone's phone and whywould Hou know photo? You know, yeah io US agree a little bit there actually,because, especially this one of the great gas, an iphone owner, one of thegreat things about androids is they are really accessible and you just need a like a male actually when Yo meet whatever youspeak, convertor cable, Pul one into your computer ont to the phone, and itopens up like I've done it. When I got rid of my old androids to get all myphotos off Okand, you could even just kind of copy and pace onto a laptop, soyou don't have to be super tixkaving. No, so that last episode we talked aboutthat. We kind of were down to like two different scenarios: one being modableindictments larger, more local, another one being not right. Being moreof you know, potentially something to do with backpage or something of thateffect and a little less local and a little less local. Now we've got alargeSUV, which I mean like screams. Like you know,...

I don't know drugs and prostitutes to me, but ylike pimps, Ik,you tryn to Sticko. Are you Serahni dve? I Wa Vecol? Did you just replay thetaking around the whole way? What vehicle did you just ro? A FordExpedition, El, all black? How many peep Wong was erly, dark, tint, yeastart on you gater. You had smokers an windows and probably like a twenty sixfoot, long SV. I don't think it s toendyd six feet b.It was longer than my truck an my charcs nineteen feet long, but how manyhorrs are N. your stable O is not called the stables called ahero. I think of Youre PIMPITS COL stable. I not familiar with the number we ser.All I'm saying is. I was driving one time down, fair drive and I pulled out-and I made this stup just fine and I got pulled over right away and when Iwound down my window because my tint was so dark, the police officer, Ithink, looks stunned to see a man in his ies with his family and hegave me a warning about my tint. I think he was looking for somethingelse yeah, but that's funny. Okay, so I've beenthere. I feel that way. You live that life. I live that life, so I feel likeI don't have tho stereotype. I think so so, but I mean like okay,what we can roll out is we don't know of anybody that was driving a large svbecause we do know some of the vehicles of different people involved in Rihe.Well, the thing that I thought was intriguing was when we asked if he could tell what color it was, andhe said it was dark, but he couldn't tell what and I think back to conny theJogger who knew it wasn't black, but it was darkyeah. But like hy picture, like my Ford Expedition and now picture the car I'mdriving now or Myour family car ar you still do you sel like a cane and a furcoat and the new car, or just you know not as much it depends on theweather. Okay, but you know it, you know they're distinctly different.I mean an expedition is very boxy and big where, like Bryan's car, you knowis not no, the smallest UV right, you know, so almost the crossover orwhatever yeah you know. So I mean they look disictlydifferent, but Connie wasn't a great. She didn't give a great statement. No, but she would know hercolors and she said it wasn't black. She did say not black and he said hecouldn't determine hat. So I just wonder if they really is too relativelysimilar. Look in cars. I mean relatively especially like me: I'm nota car guy, IO, just probably would say: SV Yeah, you know, so you don't thinkyou could tell the difference between your SV and the Svi used to have no. I could but yeah. I guess, ifyou're looking at like car photos, but if you just aske me like to describe it,I would describe them Bollte a se Ting. So so yeah I mean. Maybe it was maybeit was. You know what Connie saw was the SV leavingfirst with the hazards on and not Brian's car. You know, theinteresting thing is is like he said about the bottle being kind of crashed,but it was also a spitter bottle right, yeah, and so I mean if you're dointocrush those yeah. I mean it's kind of a normal to be crushed, but then there'sblood in the car right. But if you don't, if you go on thestory that Brian did not stab himself it, someone else was trying to extorehim, and then I don't think stage ad. I think they were trying to clean it upand ran out of he time and realized. It was a lost cause. That's what I thinkhappened in Tha. Don't you think that meaning with angry resident was part ofstaging Seeh yeah I mean I don't know. I don'tknow because I don't know who was involved. You know so I mean Itas Ust, my God. Iguess. If you're involved, there's only a couple people to talk about thisangre resident that heard about thes sanger resent Sanford notseing, one ofthem, you know. So if there's involvement in a coverup than I couldunderstand, but it's not like you had Victoria. Knowing about this angreresident now angry resident sounds like one of those like posthalk. Like I'malready in a situation. Let me start papering over it. It's like this personthat calls me all the time. It's an angry resident and then the day thatthey're going to come here and it's going to get really bad that's themeeting day and that's why I need backup and all that, like it, it notlike a really thin excuse for what was really happening. Yeah, so do you thinkBrian made up the anger resident? I think it's Yegit. I don't know. Ryanever talked about the anger, resonant, that's that's what I'm struggling. Ithink he did yeah A. I think that was his excuse for likeexcusing himself from me because, like in the bciverything that was in, hewould be like Goig to the Roomank restdit and like talk to stuff likethat yeah, but I mean we have to rely on other people. It's true. I ony saidby three people and Yeah...

...indconspicuously, not said by one. Wedon't know what that Ean Eser Yeah Yeah, but he did ask for increase patrolaround his house and they put another car I mean so Cabrian was afraid. Oh Iwave heas truly. I think it was all true except forr going to happen. Hedidn't want to say who it really was, so he called it an angry brestenbecause Mur they said I never got ta call from an neggre resident. I nevergot a call like that's pretty yeah, pretty odd too right. It is no tha. Imean the whole things od. So so you mean you're getting thesethese calls or whatever you know, but nothing's no, no call was recorded byBCI. You know so wh t th, where they reallyeven calls at all I mean we have his phone records for a whole year, so who's this angyr resident. What timewas he calling ma? There's another phone yeap, we don't know that's the thing with this case.There's there's always going to be more stones,TN, tern and every time you think you pin something down. Something elsecomes unglued. I think I said that more poletically in the beginning of theshow, I think, was let's play that cliff, but I share my brother's frustoration.It's just like the more we look at it. You know the more it gets away from you.I think there as that line from the sound of music. It's like trying tocatch a Moonbeam in your hand again with the potry. Well tell yo I'll, sayone take away from this, though, if you're thinking of committing ahomicide or anythingdower in Radina, do not do it in Adina Whil, you can getaway with it. Maybe for the police, but not from the people come on, this islike people are pouring. We have like multiple people pouring over everysecond of this data. It's crazy andthey're not connected no skin in theGani. How many times e we talked about how just you watch the national media. Yousee the way that the world in the country and everything's been going andlike you lose heart, but when you see how involved and carrying people been don,there I mean, like he's, got, sat woll of these people. We talk to donated, you know countless hours oftheir life, for no monetary GAM, no personal game just because daycare theygive a damn about a family that has dead hat's, not coming back and that's it. That's the only reasonthey're in it and and like Scott, for instance, you know,like he's, raising kids any moment that he has at spare timehe's working on the case O and you know, on a personal, not we have been donateda lot of time to this and you guys have donated a lot of your time or devoted alot of your time to listen to it with us, and we appreciate that because youcould be doing a lot of different things and you know thank you for comealong for the ride and we're going to keep updating this. It's we have so many so much new stuff coming in all thetime. So I got one more point before we get too far off. So, what's going onwith what Charlie said to the email back, which is great that Charlie, youknow, sent that emo back and is following up and sending stuff on, buthe's still sending it back to the sheriff's apartment if iy has to whichis such a struggle, though we didn't you we all along. I always thought DCIwas doing their own separate investigation here. They're, reallyjust underneath the reigns of our prosecutor, he asked them to do arshare. He invited them. In I mean I think, Charliey's evision explains itthat it's Madina County show yeah, it justinvited to the dance, but then the bandleader, you know well right. I mean,I think, that's pretty common like because of cities, rights and stuff,like that, like you have to invite them in for the most part, but I manpirusthat's how bandparents Workin so like you're struggling we werestruggling with, though, is the sheriff's O initial investigation nowthey're still in the drivers seat so like is there another agency? You canactually go to to present this information. SAYING: Hey, lookconpletely! Not This investgation completely needs to open back up, andyou know more evidence needs to be collected. People need to be talk toyou and we've talked to people hit whenever in. Would it be great if therewas some burial investigation at a federal level? That could do somethingwell, but why would they they don't have an turisdiction unless somethinghappened at Thet airport across state lines? If you don't cross at lines, youknow you don't want te fence, sicktheir, nose and everything point other raises a liberatarianargument that I agree with. So I'm mued special thanks for this episode goesout to Bob and Scott. You guys have done a tremendous amount of work and wereally appreciate it stuff. You found INS fantastic. Every little nuggethelps push the needle closer to reopening the case and getting justicefor the macit family. We will never ever ever, give up onethe Briar acicase ontell. There is a...

...inviction, so anytime we get newinfirmation d. It will bring updates to you just like this. We are in themiddle of working on our next season and we're really excited to be bringingthat to you. We have some really cool interviews lined up. We teased it a little bit. It's goingto be about the circle build case, so I can't wait to bring you guys all onfoard and I want all of our listeners and all the people that help us fromfacebook group webpage and visible ships. Podcastcom everybody coit. Allyou guys. We need you to come with us and we need your help to look at someof the other Ohio ful cases. We love crowd sourcing with you guys, I think,together as a community, we can just bring answers and shed light on some ofthe Stuf in the meantime, find us on faceboot, follow us on twitter or anintagram anywhere that you can communicate with us. If you have anyinformation about the Brian Macatasono, just have terall of that ELN. Take allthat onsineration. Lastly, and most importantly, remember that there'sstill a reward hown that would lead conviction. The BRIMMA is with PrimeStopper, so you do know anything. You have intemation on tect mine, SelfiFirst, but also share your theories with, as in once again, we really wantto hear them do as a favor subscribe to us on either itunes or spotify, or oneof the platform podcast that you listen on and give us a review. A positivereview on mituns really helps spread the word and gets e, the showout tomore people and the more people that we have listening. The bigger group is andthe more that we can crowd source thes. Okay, you guys take care seeou later.

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