Invisible Ships podcast
Invisible Ships podcast

Episode 13 · 11 months ago

The Murder Lake BCI Files

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Think this case is solved? Think again Danny, Darren and Rick go through the BCI file and find that this isn't the slamdunk the media and authorities tried to paint it as. There are glaring inconsistencies and some eyebrow-raising discoveries. We play you the actual police interviews and much more.   

Time for the invisible ships podcast,where we talk about everything from true crime to Ge, truly weirdinvisibotions podcast, guys by now. Everyone knows that BCI has concludedits investigation into Brian mackron's death and rule that no one else wasinvolved that he had acted alone. The official Verdic is in it was all astage: suicide. Okay. I got some things to say about that and let me start offby saying that Danny Darin to myself, we are not trained investigators, we'renot doctors, we're not foresic, scientist or amateur sliths. No we'renot we're podcasters, but we also have enough common sense to know whensomething doesn't seem right. If you thought that the Brian Mackron case wasclosed, when Madina County Prosecutor Force Thompson gave his press briefeed,I want you to keep your mind open, and I want you to listen this episode,because what you're about to hear does not come from me Dan Yor Daren. It'snot coming from Paul Hartman and is not coming from Victoria Mackron we'regoing through the BCI file. You guys- and there is a treasure trove of audiointerviews where BCI agents were sitting down with the detectives andfirst responders and people that had very intimate ties to this case in thisinvestigation and we're finding a lot of contradictions and we're going toshow them to you today on this show. What is important for you to remember,though, is that you're going to hear things in here that are going tocontradict what the official narrative is, what the newspapers have beentelling MOU what the news has been telling you. I just want you to keep anopen mine and remember that this is not coming from us. This is coming from theinvestigavs Danny Darren, where we at you know,we've seen the BC report we're going through it. Each of us has a copy andthere's a lot in there, but we're slowly working our way through it. Howyou feeling about the case? Have you changed your mind or youropinion? Do you think that Brian committed suicide, or are you stillholding out that he was murdered? I don't think you'll ever see me movefrom the murder side. I mean unless we get some crazy evidence, but you know Ithink, in this episode like what you guys wewere talking about off air and Danny. I think you ere doing alot of work with looking up the different searches and stuff alreadywas kind of skeptical because of conversations we've had with Paul. Hesaid because he's the one who found these and keep in mind he's the one tofound these and he still doesn't buy that it was the suicide, but he turnedhim over because he's you know an honest, investigator Butyou know, look in them over the thefirst one is a link to a flog called Dr Kelly's death time for the truth, andthe search is death and single cut ristartery. So we followed that link.That's a bug dedicated to the cold case of this Dor Kelly inEngland, who was the government declared that hecommitted suicide, but people suspect Fou, play and murder and basically, whohe was, is back in two thousand and three he gave the British governmentinformation leading to the British government's involvement in the IraqWar Right Aso, a WMD inspector yes and Iraq and e supposedly found weapons of mass destruction, or it wason that Tran, yes, and he was in wancs the tied of public opinion in Englandturned against the war and everything they accused him of sexing up theinformation to lete the war and he just kind of fell out of public favor, butstill probably, maybe not enough to go, kill yourself and then ithere's an article in the BBC, but hethey say he walked out into the woods one day cut himself to pills and sumped overdead in the woods. So when you look at the search history- and with that inmind, you can look at his next search...

...was foretded. How do you save someonewith Tho cutthroat? He visited Cananan frees to death overnight. If it getscold enough, he visited how does sem one sever, their coroded artery withthe kitchen knife. How long does it take the doctor being stabbed? So youknow in the Hindsit of the way Mr mackren died. That makes it sound likemaybe he was researching astoes die, but if he was investigating a couldcase of his own that he was interested in from two thousand and three,although searches kind of make a lot more sense, and it's just really hardto escape the irony at the fact that his search was for an unsolved podcaseof a person that the government is saying killed himself. But a lot ofpeople think didn't tit was found, t exposes in the in the woods it is sostrange. I mean you can't crazy. You know they say fiction is straight ortrue. The steris is athertation yeah. That is totally the case here kind of makes. You wonder, like I, like the theory that maybe hejust was interested in this cold case and through, like the craziest twist ofirony, ended up just like that, or was he planning on, you know actually committing suicide.Arthis is the best way, one of the best ways to stage it. I don't know I meanagain just going back to that state suicide. You know what, if I mean, I don't know, I'm not. I don'tevenknow what to say it's just it's very crazy, but to me the biggest thingabout this: Is it sort of just modeys up hi the Google Search Angleenough to me that I can't really draw conclusion either way on it? You knowbecause that first search I mean he could be. Ihave searched this kind of stuff myself working on the Brian macin case, somaybe he was working on the Dr Kelly case. You know I mean, if you'reinterested in something you're going to look at it further like. Is this evenreally possible? You know so I mean I can totally fandhom yea that this thesesearches could go together like that, you know, Judge for yourself. You know it's justweird the whole idea of a stage suicide. It's a really strange thing I mean Wen.We talk about suicides are sadly not superrare, but suicide that you're trying to stage onto look like another prime, like a burder. Those got to be extremely rare,extremely rare one of our listeners. Sarah sent us in another link about a very elaboratestate suicide. So the reason I want you to hear this is because it kind ofillustrates something that you'll see in any stage suicide that the planning,however elaborate and Rhowever simple in the staging, are all done before theperson begins to commit suicide. So there's exceptions to every rule, andyou know what the investigators want us to accept in the Brig Makrin casis thathe was staging office in different placely that tolook like a crime sceme while he was committing suicide, but listen to thiscase out of Florida, where it involves a high amount of planning before thegentleman ended up committing suicide. At first it appeared to be a murdercase when a seventy one year old Palm Beach Gardens man was found dead in afield next to his country club home with a bollet wind to his chest. But onThursday, after a six month, investigation police released a reportthat concluded Alan J Abrahamson killed himself and stated as a homicide. Theprevailing theory backed by emails receipts, Computer Search Histories andphone records. Far Fetched as it may seem, is that Abrahamson tied a stringto a gun, attested to a weather, balloon shot himself and let goallowing the ballooning gun to float far away from the crime seane.According to the report, the balloon could have taken the gun, a hundred andfive thousand feet up nearly twenty miles and then exploded somewhere outover the Atlantic Ocean north of the Bahamas. To be honest with you, it'sjust a bizarre situation. CINICAL psychologist, Dr Raphy Wald toldwpeccbs twelve whil we're geing the case. I can honestly say that in mypractice I have never had anyone fake a homicide and commit suicide. Wow. Thatcase is insane. I can't believe it's true, but it is, and the reason againthat we wanted you to hear is just to...

...show you that these things do happen.They're, incredibly rare and there's a lot of clues that investigators areable to uncover and find that the planning has been going on for a longtime and and in the stagin. And so, when you look at the Prime Mackrin case,I mean it's hard to really even formulate t the plan that he was goingthrough. So he went to the office and he was going to try to stage it to looklike he was murdered there and that's why he made up the story about theangry resident, but then, for whatever reason, he changed his mind and decidedto stop stabing himself to get in his car and drive down a chipwile lake freezing cold early morning and wanderoff. The one thing that I keep thinking andI can't get away from, though, is that WHO's ever committed suicide and manageto hide their own body. I mean, I, don't, I think, Brian mackrid, if this,if it turns out if you agree with BCI- and you agree with the investigatorsthat this was an elaborately- stayed suicide, it's so hard to get away fromthe fact that it was months before they found his body right and we've gotmonable. So some people are really dogging and I was one of the peoplethet really dog, that they really didn't search at all. You know nowlistening to all the people that did provide searches, including the parksdepartment, and how you know how much time they put intosearching that lake was pretty well searched. They know everything aboutthat lake th. I learned stuff about chip Wal Lake. Just from listening tohis interview, I mean so he searched t. He had multiple people to search theinlets. He had moltable people search the lake, not necessarily directly onthe sixteenth, but thereafter, and he even said he goes. He told hiscrew eecause there's no way that we're going to let a body show up in thespring when everybody's out at our lake. So let's play the interview: It's inthe BCI file e just playit, okay. Today's date is June, twenty, twothousand and eighteen. The time now is hundred and twenty pm. I am personally at the Madina CountyPark district located at six three six, four deervew lane Madina Ohio, fourfouro, five. Six and presently I am with David Schweinhart. He is a chiefranger for the Medinic county parks, district David, a Fwinehart, sw ine,Hart. Okay and your currently are the chief Hare. Yes sirbut the next fewminutes, they go over personal details, exchanging business cards, but thenthings get really interesting. Can you kind of go through on the what happened on December, the SixteenTwo Thousand and sixteen? What how that unfolded, weather condition is and soforth. On December sixteenth, I was on on Shefthat morning the Sheriff Department received a callof a missing person with suspicious circumstances from the Pafia town ship hall, which is abouttwo miles from our office building. They described the scene as a bloodymess and we're looking for Brian Mackeron, whohad went missing so being in the area. I offered myassistance to help look for him outside of the or within the park, boundaries and soforth, because we have a big perea of property that runs from rout. Forty twoall the way down through Chipawal Vacas Park district with an with a three mileinlet, pave trail that ies a biking and hikingtrail with water on one side and wet landpreservation on the other side. So we we begin checking that area, and so my first started up at BuckeywoodsPark, which is next door to our...

...headquarters. We do have a pond there.It's maybe a five Acre pond with a as falt trail around that pondas well. So we want to make sure that nobody drove any vehicles up theredrove into the pond. So I checke that- and there was nothingI continued to drive the trail up to the north inlet trail parking area, an d.We also have an inlet oop up there as well for a wetland preservation with a smallbody of water. More so just a wet land. It's not very deep, maybe two threefeet deep tops, didn't notice anything up therecontinued down, it drove the drove the entire inlet trail, all the way down toChippewal road. Just looking for anything unusual now,the one thing I did notice is that the eetrail was froze over the whole time.There were no breakage in the ice anywhere along that trail whence youcom me, Abouk to weather conditions, to what was the wether condictions on onDecember sixteenth. What was like, if you recall it, I recalit, being very,very cold and windy. It was about five degrees out in bitter Col, wind, to the point where I actually put myski gloves and Tobog and had on when I was outside of the car. So it was, itwas cold. Okay, it was not snowing at the time. We may have gotten a little bitovernight in terms of a dusting, but nothing nothing of an accumulatedamount, and when you said you were looking for unusual things, you werelooking for footprints in in that now or right. I was looking for footprintsin the snow. I was looking for tier tracks into the inlet. I was lookingfor disruptions to the ice where maybe it had broken refroze overnight. I didn't see any of that so at at that point I started looking at ditch lines aroundthe park area and I had originally been when the call came in. I was originallyat the Chipwalla public on tramp on the west side of the lake, so I a got thereand, as I came up to buck, I woulds I was looking in ditch lines along theway up, ballish road. When I drove the inlet trail back down,I then checked ditch lines along Chipawa Road, backup, Balash rodgetting out of the car checking calver pipes, a SA checking call you actuallylooking insid looking inside the calvert pipes, because at this pointyou know with what I had information wise from the sherffs department, an with the amount of blood that I wastold was at the scene. We were kind of in the mindset that maybe we werelooking for a body versus a missing person, so I was in more of a recovery mode than a search and rescuekind of mode. Okay, so I was looking inthe colvert pipes, woed drove back acouple farm fields along the way and over at the corner of Ballishan stateroute, O hundred an sixty two there's, a series of old barns that sat thereand I pulled in there got out and check those as well didn't see anythingdidn't have any tire tracks going into thim and haviny footprints around himwent into the barns tit anything out of sit there as out of the ordinary thereas well. This patch ultimatelyy come back andsaid they h located the car at Chipwall Vake Beach, which is at the corner of beatsideboulevard and long Acre Wane, and we visited thatjust a little bit ago, Yeah Sir, so I responded down there see what I coulddo to a system as well. When I arrived, deputy Denado was already there. I believe detective Shizmenos, who was there alsohe's no longer whether sheriffs office, he retired, and eventually deputy king arrived, who was thesheriff's Department Canine Unit? So he...

...worked this dog around the area. As a couple more depities arrived, I took my ranger that was working rangerwhideeg and we continued to search the area. The one thing we did notice,while we were down at the lake is there were no footprints in the snow goingover to the body of water. The lake was iced over and the only part that was thought was a middle section of thelake itself. The only footpist we saw in the snowaround the lake were an older couple who were walking their dog when we had came down to the vehicleFather Nethe wit, no footprints D, nothing that indicated that he wentinto the Lakeor on to the ice of that point. was there anything around hispeople that you noticed as far as footprints and there were noprints around the carbecause there was no snow or anything on the pavement? I didn't notice anyblood. I figured if there was ad much blood at the township hall that maybethere was some bled around his car, something that we could track and therewas nothing okay. Deputy Denado went south along thebeach through the private access gramp forboat, launch to Lork that direction, while RangewiWhiteg and I went back north and ultimately, we got in our cars and wewent back up towards the inlet, as well as the chipwall nature, preserve onChipwal rout once again check that area pretty welllooking for any disruptions or anything unusual, just doing double checks back over to the public, Lonc ramp andcheck the west side, boundary shores didn't see any disruptions or anythinginusual over there. At one point, I met with LieutenantWyns got from the sheriff's department down at the chip Awal on rap, and hehad been in the area conducting some recom as well, and at that point I recall I doremember he was talking with Osp the still has statepatrol because they had launched a plane into the area. They were doing agrit search of chippawallake and the s surrounding wet lands and and theynever never sorn to car anything that antkind of work. That way right, I know at one point we got a I did getout of the car. I believe Wynscott did as well, because we wantd a doublecheck just because of the nature of the situation. We want to double check andmaries. We had already checked and and checked underneath the bridge of theinlet on Chipewal road adjacent to the park, and there were no disruptions aroundthe bridge abutment or to the ice below noand. I it wasprooverhere a was froze over as well e O familiarize anybody sostening this tape, the thepublic boat round for launch bran, that's on the west side of the lake,that's correct in the the inmigrage that you've talked about and that's onthe northern north side, an lik in in tha private parking area are the publicparking area, that's on the where the beaches and so forth. That's on theeast side of the like, and it actually it's north of the old chipwalllag park.Correct. That's no one! Eriy operation, that's correct! Okay, as your day went on, did it did? wasthere anything else, turnup from from the searches in the area? Did you findanything it ar do you know if anybody found anything suspicious? No, not that.I'm aware of and in fact we wwe made it a point to patrol down there extra that day aswell as the next couple days, because...

...the one thing that I told my rangerswas, I don't want to find a body foting on our wak come springtime, so we madeit a point for about two or three days afterwards to just double check ourwork. Checking calver pipes again just thattracking our steps, because we wedidn't want to have a negative connotationcome on the part district,because you know it is our lake and you don't want that kind of stigma. Tie to your right public meteria, hiscar, when you, when his car was found, it wasn't pulled with the front end ofthe car in towards the lake. Was it no, it was not. It was a sitting paralvelto the lake across parking spaces and het would have been probably cul wouldhave been facing. It would have been facingselfh and in intersection againas peach side in a long Nagerlane, and it's kind of like ind of north end ofthe the parking litedsolt right, that's correct! Okay, did you get a chance to look at the carvery well? I did look at the car. Did you have any any observations from forrecollections from your observations to Lookinto Carpboll, I recalld the ACLANdid it seemed like it was pretty clean. The Sea did seem like it was pulledforward, a little bit which, which I kind of thought was a little odd,because the front Shan the driver seat was ork forward a little bit. I thought it was kind of ot because Ido know Brian as he wasn't. towship trusty and I've had dealings with himbefore not on a personal level, but on a professional level and throughacquaintance with the Sergeant Sandford at the sheriff's Office, and I knew Bryan was a bigger guy. So II kind of thought it was odd that the seat was pulled up a little bit because he goes probably about two.Sixty to two hundred eighty pounds, probably about six foot call- and Ithought yeah it's odd, but but I didn't really think anything of it and I did notice a little bit of bloodaround the Steringlott area. The interview ends with officerSwineheart, discussing the day that Brian mackren's body was discovered inthe lake and some of the just technicalities of how they got him outof the water. The big takeaway that I get from this is the fact that therewere competent officers there on the beach that day and that dny these guysknew the lake right they. This is their patrol rout they're. The Rangers thatwork there an now, I think, really wellguforunately a sort of kindof got off in the original information that was released on the story but obacksmos likely spots Toso, I n'tThinkno, and I really think that if Brian was there, they would have foundit remember that, for the theory to work for Brian to get washed into theLake Doriana thaw, he would have to be pretty close to the shore yeah. I think especially knowing theras temdoing it Aon, and what do you think about thecar seat being pulled forward? Is that just a minor detail, or do you thinkthat is a larger clue? I mean certainly kind of sounds like maybe bion the carand it Wasa small. You smallr man or woman, or something I just the one other thing I wanted tosay about the search aspect is you know, we've all been to this area we kyactearound it. I mean it's, it's whatit's like natural, it's kindof rural, but it's not dense woods like with the way people search it would youwould think they would find it.

I would think I mean, especiallybecause you got a gentleman who's bleeding during that time, but e itssnow, the ground is Coveredan Sein this snow yeah and I also there's adiscrepant in whether ther were search dogs that day or not, and I kind ofthrough the BSIR report I found where they said they did have search dogs,auter and I don't know how well they can pick up sens with that kind of coldtemperature, but also another interesting thing that I want to play.I want to play the runner video today for you guys, because particularlythat's the one that force Thompson said that he had. There was an eye witnessputting Ma Brian mackron walking towards the inlets, and I think afteryou listen to it. You'll agree that wasn't Brian Mackron, what's Herit, just a quick note, you guys, while wewere going through the BCI file, we came across this audio interview with aJogger and the reason that we're not telling you her name, even though thisinformation is public record, is the fact that she's very adamant with theinvestigator that she wishes to remain anonymous, and we have to respect that.You know she said that she doesn't want to be hounded by people or havereporters at her door or whatever. So you know, she's not involved other thanjust being a potential eye witness to something so we're going to leave hername out of it and we're not going to be giving that information out. As I understand it, you were a Dra Gane one morning and aris stop bipe a sheriff's captain who talked to you briefly. Dou recall thatyeah, okay and t that was captain senther from the Dina County Sheriff'sOffice, and there was also another person with him. I his name is ArvanClar. He was from BCI and I think they probably asked youquestions about. If you' see anything suspicious in the area, do you recallthat particular contect? I remember them asking me questionAnsur, okay and N at a later time, apparently it's my understanding. Youmay have called the sheriff's Office Yeh a because you had a recollection orsomething I did. Okay, could you could you tellme what what you recall? If you still recall it, I'm assuming you do or sorokay. I had gone out to jog at my normal time.It was SI thirty. It was dark. That's why I stay in town and it was cold thatday. So I remember dressing for the weather. It was probably like seventeendegrees or whatever that day, Itas pretty coold d. You recall the DA soddw. What do you mean? Do I recall it a intrsignificance about the particular day or the date of the day or anything likethat? You can now not really now my husband leaves for work about fivethirty and then I'm out by hi thirty run in the street. I typically I'll go out and I'll turnto the right and run when it's dark, like that. I just stay in town, so Irun under the straight lights and I ran beach. Sider I'll run beach side. Istart running north and I go up to like Tobor road and then I'll turn aroundand come back. When I came back, that's when I saw agentleman walking on the other side of the street and I said good morning didn't know him and two things kind of went through mymind number one. He must not be a morning person because he didn't sayanything and number two for as cold as it is. He sure wasn't dressed very well,an very like appropriately. He had like a Hoodie up over his head that THA AA was dark. I don't knowunder the street like we had just kind of met and it was at that point. I rundown to the beach and that's when I saw a car park there and it was weirdlyparked as if it had stopped at the...

...stopsign there and just pulled forwardwhen you say he was underdresse. Do you recall anything about the color of theclothes he had on? Or could you toln s? Goinan Awful Lithis is Wowyeah Ato. Iremember a Hoodie being up OOver his head. I do remember that was it blue, Geni or red or make possibly that I I dont Lo Hallat's match not aproblem, that's not a problem, so the jogger mentions that he waswearing a Hoodie. Was Brian mackrin found wearing a Hoodie? No, he wasn't. I don't know who she'sseen, but when they pull Bryan markon out of the lake he had on a sweaterbutton up, collored shirt. I think it was blue jeans and a pair of boots onit. Was it sweater, red or blue, because she said she thought it wasblue or Red Hoodie. I thought it was gray, but I think alsothe thing to nowt. As as soon as I heard this interview, I had to get ahold of Victoria because it's like dis did you have a missing Hoodie and whenher response was no Hoodie, he doesn't own a Hoodie he's, not a Hoodie guy.You know- and I think you are you aren't you know I mean there's.Definitely you know o Aty Guy, so she get. There saw Brian Markron that dayfor American change, closer shedded, Shado, Hoodie or something or shepossibly saw one of the people that was involved in his murder or dropping offhis vehicle, and I know you know she mentioned it's dark because it's winterin northeast Ohio was it's dark at six thirty in the morning, but if he wasbleading is badly as often as Brian was you think that would be noticeable andI think we should all put together. The Michael Taylor interview to yes,Michael Taylor was someone we interviewed in an earlier episode, anyreportd scene prettwhat's the same thing: Let's play it Ri Oo, the WaterSas firs neer because I was onthe Ne Spice Fitin think nothing othat. I got down opin tomake that AU Rightandtim by the beach and I sen, the o Carson there on think nothing ever haven't heard,hear anything eduntmewas somebody was walking, thersa basketball cor downthere, someod alking rom them on the other. Tod O baseballor andhehe places a gentleman with a blackhoodie walking around close to the car that morning as well, you know did notthink it was Brian. He didn't fit, his description did not fit Brian, and so I mean I think it could be the sameperson. I will say one thing that she mentions. That I think is good is howshe said it struck Heris odd that where she was right by the inlet and that ithad flooded a little bit recently and the lake wasn't frozen and there's allthose like. I like cat tails, all the things that stick up there, that shesais something coul get caught on and then, when it melted, come up to thelake, it's possible. That was the site wherehe was kind of dumped or whatever right I mean the person was headed towardsthe top end of the inlets, where we think Brian would have ended up. Thehard part is, is this isn't brain? The sweater he was wearing was was grayright. I guess if there was blood on it that could make it kind of red, but shekeeps saying potty four times she says Hoodie puhe over the head over the head.What Os that man he's not wearing the...

...hoody he's got Ta cover in his face e.He is Ra, put pulled up over there's no way to mistake that for a sweater likea sweater is no Ood, yeah and Brian didn't have so. The onlan sweater andthe only identification that she can do is really just the faceshot of a Hoodie.How well can you recognize somebody with their hoodup? So an the only otherhood we've heard is in the Michael Taylor interview right there right, andI think what I want you guys. Listen to next is how the investigator getsexcited at the end. Had you ever seen him in the area before? Did you recallno Sir know- and I know pretty much- it's e gets kind of ISM, you kno wand. We know everybody'sroutines and it's like okay, if you're, you know when somebody's running lateor you knowwhen somebody yeah like okay, you got mcdone whatever. Yes, we areabsolutelycould, you tell if him what his race was was se whiter black. He was not black okay and how about a physical description? Culyou tell how tall it was or how it was din heavy anything he was not e was notten. The gelman was not, then I could nottell you how tall he was Andon Asin an awful lot. Fom you to adothat e Hahatokayhatlike. I can't imagine what you know what they wantand I as well maybe it's about- and I thought Oh Jeez at that's beont a while, well, okay, to be completely honestwith you. I just found out about you this past week. Otherwise I would havetalked to you. wellthere was kind of a glitch in their paperwork that wasgiven to me. I never was given your in England doesn't didn't appearin the original paperwork that they gave me. I don't believe this, becausehere we have this Jogger, who is possibly very, very important. Witnessyou either saw Brian where she saw the people that are behind Brian'sdisappearance right and portant, hugely important and they're just gettingaround to talking to her now. So it's two thousand and twenty when thisinterview was recorded. So it's been four years and she even says that someof her, you know, details and stuff may be a little hazy, because it all thattime is passed to the point when they called her. She didn't know what theywere calling her about right. She probably would be scared if fo him whowant to do. I don't know what do, but that's a lot of Timeis PASSD, it'shighly concerning I mean you know, there's so many things that areconcerning and I'm just going to go on a quick little rant here. But you knowthis is his last interview in the BCI file and he's still every interview. Hecan't even get Brian's last name right. He mispronounces it every time hemissed. He doesn't even remember who his wife is in some of the interviewsand- and this he's corrected numerous times in these interviews from theother people that are interving ued to it's mackrin. You know so I mean howcan you not get his name right? First of all, second of all, sentner is theone that did this initial interview now he's the gentleman that came out in twothousand and seventeen with the cliff hanger ending that we started ourpodcast, basically off, of where Brian acted alone, which we're going to play.That interview later he's the gentleman that did this interview with thisperson originally and then just didn't, send it over to the BCI. So I mean whatelse didn't the BCI get that we don't have of key information to helpactually solve this murder? Okay, and I ended up talking to one of the investigators from a DinaCounty. I did an interview with him week before last and he came up with a jogger a that he talked to. Theydidn't have your name, so I had to go back on research. Everything have hasheriffs office, pull all their paper workout and that's how it came up withyou and okay in yeah. The information that you have is very vital to theinvestigation. If do you think, did you...

...ever tell anybody, or do you feel thatthat was Brian mccron? That you saw? Did you ever see any pictures of branclean well after his picture was like clastered all over the papers? I mean I could say yes, but I don'tknow because it was dark. It's just it's odd. I find it odd that when they found the body in the lake, if you look it's right in line with theanlet right right that Wak had not. It was unusual in that the lake hadflooded a couple of times at winter. It usually doesn't do that. It really never froze over and it wasfrozen around the edges that day, but it wasn't prasing the middle and there's a lot of breash in the inletthat things can get hung up on and when the lake, when it rises and floods, itfits it all out into the lake I tust hat. I guess my feeling was that that's where his body ended up and when you saw him he was ther.There's nobody else around him and hi was. He was just walking on his ownyeah. Did you appear to have any like hem for lack of a better word IMOsay drunk, but I don't think he was drunk, but did he appear that he hidany kind of injury or ailment that was it waswalking slow as walking fast? Could you Wu he was walking at a slower pace andI'm not a very fast dogger. In fact, what's weird, as I thought I would beturning around and probably passing him again, you know coming up from behindand I never did. I never saw the the gentleman ever again that it that morning I never did and hewas north Boan. You were softh ball when you passed him yeah, okay, alet'sgo back to the car that you saw in the parking lot tether the curnt. You said that the carappeared to your impression Mas that might havestopped at the stop. tryining just pulled a head and just pull it forward.The way it was Har Shit in Poin to a carkin like a doesert Grad, Oarchastman ot ter, I INA plan normally how how we all pull into the BESparking lot. Could you cayou tell what color o the car was? It was dark andthe? U I mean it was it was under street like th, the color of the carwas dark, which is why I thought it was Thi outhern Gals, because she drives ablack vehicle. This was not black, though, when I got up on it. It wasclearly different, but it was a dark. Color. Okay was therning, light song inthe side of it. There was a right, don't recall, but they were aininglighttime. So it's a little strange that she's adamantly saying it wasn'tblack. We know Brian's car was black and his brine's car was found there. Iguess I winness, you know you always hear that thing, but I winte statementsthat they don't have a huge amount of credibility in court, just because twopeople can see the same thing at the same time and have two differentmemories of it. So it could be that, but I mean maybe it was a different car.I mean we don't know like four years later to Itas four years later tooright. I think the one thing I do like about it is her husband left at fivethirty in the morning and stakes that there was no car there, and then shecame at thirty, so that kind of helps us to narrow down when the car got possibly put there, but don't evenknow for sure if it was Brian Carl, though the way it's, she describes howit's parked and, I think that's fairly consistent, but the color. Shedefinitely was adamant that it, it didn't match just thought, experimentwhat, if people in a different coor but similartype of car drove him there dumbped him...

...went back, got his car drove separate. So two cars lefthis car through the keys and it locked it got in the blue or whateverdifferent coar car and drove away, and she just happened to see the first one.No, I don't agree with that. Okay, just because remember, if we're operating onthe insumption the brand was murdered, we don't believe his body was in thelake that morning. That's why they they wouldn't havefound him right. But I to me the him being. reber doesn't hinge on his bodynot being in the lake. I think it's weird that they would have missed it,but you know to me one of the my kind of theoriesand we'll see if you know where this goes, I think, even if he wasintentionally murdered, it migh have been more of an intentional beating andhe died from it, so they might not have really known that they left themanywhere yeah. I just kind F of a hard time with him. If he was there, theyshould have found him that morning I know but, like I said before, and itdidn't make you upy last time, but stranger things have happened like it,wouldn't be the most unbelievable thing in the world for them to Walk Right,past his body and not see it because sometimes stuff happens and it's ID. Inoticed it right away. My husband who lieaves it thirty would have noticed itbecause he goes that way. You Nal hi stuff at the Buach, stop and then turnsleaft and goes up. It was park so weird that he would have noticed in it wasnot there at ive thirty, the VIHIPL was not there. Hey, okay and You'e talkedto him about it. Ismy husband, YS, Oh yeah, because he definitely he would havenoticed that yeah. Like I say you have a vital piece ofinformation that was overlooked of Fortunatelis AI. Think that you know, obviously it would have beenbetter sure if it would h been more kindy, not not not from your part fromthe other people involved spart if they were to tri o have inor, So YourRecollection May have been a little bit. You know: Buzzer Yeah, well, yeah, absolutelyosolutely. Okay, so he's awfully excited about finding this woman andher testimony. He thinks that they have a smoking gun. That he's beeninstructed to wrap it up right and he think that this is the piece that he'smissing. What do you think y? Absolutely I mean you can tell in hisvoice that he's excited. He. You know feels that if this would have been outsooner that this could have solved the case faster. You know he has been. Iind my opinion. He has been looking F to prove the case of suicide from theGedgo. He asked the sheriff's apartment, sers, partment, that's their conclusion,although you know originally, they thought that he ran and then when theyfound him they' like Oh, we didn't run so I guess he just killed himself andthat', that's literally what they where they went for. That's that's what theinterview talks about in the BCI report just in summarizing it up, but you knowso he jumps on it. As this is the this is it. This is Brian Walking into theinlets. Even though we've already talked about Brian wasn't wearing aHoodie, he doesn't match description. She can't even identify him as BrianShe's like I could say, but I after I've seen it, but I really don't knowit's been four years. You know and she ye can't identify it as even beingBrian. How come the footprints don't match at the scene, the crime with what Brianwas wearing, because it wasn't brin and also again why doeses he bother them.That scene is so messy. I think a lot of that. They just can't make any callson like Iu, feel like there's dog prance, there's footprints, thosephotos I mean it's like they took photos after they had already beenthere for hours. It looks like they maybe were taking pictures of their ownfootprints. I don't know, but you know we put up the pictures a while back ofBrian's boots, it's a very distinctive pattern and we're seein the pictures wehave here inside the office where...

...there's some bloodyfootprints in thereclearly from briant's boots very distinctive foot pattern on there, butat the area round the car and at the lake, those flopprints aren't there, and this doesn't bothering theinvestigators. I think that people just want to move on and we've seen it fromsome of the media. That's been covering it like some of the newspapers andstuff they say slam dunk could shut. You know they solved this, but as we'regoing through and we're looking at the evihis guys, like you point out withthe video during it's one, it's not a continuous feed camera to the video isso far away that all you're seein our headlights. We have no idea of Frianwas alone. If there are other people. You also told me that there maybe was another carthey're seen. No. There definitely was another car on video that pulled intothe parking lot. While Brian was there. You know- and you know what thedetective or Charlie the BCI agent chalked it up as he chucked it up as acar pulling in to dump creamer in their coffee. That must have been what theydid now. We never saw the car even leave because the camera timed out, butit was in the time zones of when the two videos we have a brin entering andthen Brian leaving now the car was in there for close to. I think two minutes,at least until the timer timed out the video timed out and then the next timethat something at the store triggers the cameras to go on, and we get adistant few of the drive Le Into Bryan's office. We don't see that caranymore right, so we say that Brian was the only one there, but we know therewas another car there Y. is that the only way in or out correst? Listen tothis guys? This is what we're talking about. Here's a little clip of BCIinvestigator talking to a Modina County, Sheriff's Department investigator namedCartwright. This is what he has to say about that car. We were talking aboutnow. It's getting after one o'clock down the sixteenth wes. We see a vehicle polin or from thefrom the videos that we have from Latti mark see a Vehiclepo plany came fromthe east pulls in to the market or not the Markens, ar into the town hall. Essentially like we discussed, therewas no other vehicles there that came in arout during that time, essentially was very otraffic at all. When it's getting closer to six o'clock,you do see a vehicle come in pull into the lot and basically pull back out it was it was' was not. There was notenough. PIME SPAN for anybody to have gotten out of that. Musical KidnapBryan put hit back in the vehicle men leave. We did post on our website thevideo surveillance, which I thought was very interesting because they say thatthey've got this picture of Brian Coming and going and no one else wasthere now guys in the VCI report which we're not going to probably have airedfor you but and the B report. They say: Oh well, there actually was one morecar there, but then I think also what's really important here- is that theyrethere? This camera is not a continuous feed camera. There is Jeez. I don't even know fifty hundreddifferent small video clips in the BCI folder, which, if anybody has like aring or anything like that. You know that it's motion activated yeah and Ithink it's important for people to realize to o if they haven't checkedout the video that we're talking about a video of security, footage Cameroright from the Lafaette market, which is across the street and down awaysfrom the drive that Brian Makron would have to use to access the LafiaTownship Administration belike. So this...

...is coming on when customers and thingslike that are arriving or leaving the Lafie market, not necessarily anyaction happened. An LAFIYETT and the fire department is sort of in the waybetween the township building, it'slike township, building firt departmentright there and then the Security Carema Footao gn beg you hear mysecurity o just Wen off when you're talking about that Rin. If you want anat spot weird an but thes cars are flying by a d. You can't see anythinglike these cars could be full of people or have one person. You just know whatto tell right. You definitely don't know, and you I mean you can guess thatit's his car, but you really don't know you can't ges all you can see or heslike and let mes slake this too, because I've been reading the commentsand stuff that people cen posting about it. Almost everybody misses the factthey were looking at the cars coming off of Wedgewood in turning and thinking that one ofthose is Brian's car. You have to look in the extreme upperright corner of thevideo. You just see little headlights and that's Brian's car yeah, so I guessI would say if you haven't looked at the videos of the BCI reports, webelieve we have links for that and it's just important to just kind of you know. If you just fread the report,you would think they had CSI crystal clear vision of the car and the licenseplay and everything going on hat. It's not right. We're fortunate that we havesome video footage with the rural area that we're in, but you definitelycannot tell for sure. If that's Brian's car, you definitely do not have twentyfour hour video footage either you only have it when it's activated, which isso huge and it's k. You know it's very convenient that it did activate, butthere's no way that that thing can sense all the way into that lafitttownship parking lot to send that camera off. It has to be something upfront and every time there's something up front. That's happening thattriggers that camera to see, and we even have different reports in the'rein the BCI file of Brian. Not You know, leaving and possibly coming wil his car,possibly coming back or being seen elsewhere throughout the township aswell that night in between those hours of two o eight and six am so you know,if that's the case, then we're definitely missing footage at thelaffit market and the reason is is because it's not continuous feed camera. Here's. Whatwe'RE GOING TO DO! I'm going to play a little snippet from Captain DavidSetner he's with the Madina County sheriff's apartment. He did a pressconference and he's laying out the official story in timeline about whathappened that night to Brian Mackrin, and then I want to compare that andcontrast that, with some audio evidence that we discovered with more interviewsfrom investigators about stuff that they're saying in the BCI file thatcontradicts this official story. Yet this is what everyone ended up agreeingto, and this is what they're promoting the official story. So you be the judge,listen to these clips and then you make your own determination. The purpose ofthis press conference is to provide an update of the investigation tof thedeath of Brian Mackron, based on all the information that we have to date.As you know, the Modina County Sheriff's Office was notified of MerMacken's disappearance at approximately seven Thrte am on December. Sixteendeputies were immediately dispatched to the township administration buildingand the mackron home, and at this time an investigation was opened andinitiated withan hour and ten minutes. Mister mackren's vehicle was locatedvia onstar detection park and the beach tide parking lot. Next to Chipwall Lake,it's important to note, leading up to Mister Makren's death that mistermackrin himself had incurred a large conservable large amount of financialdebt, along with other personal behaviors. He was engaged in e, wereunknown to his family and friends that we will not go into detail at this time. Video surveillance from Aria,businesses and residences showed Viron back was vehicle driving route or theearly mornings of December sixteenth, which began with his arrival at thetownship administration. Building. An hundred and fifty am his vehicle left,the township building, an approximately...

...six twenty four am, and I its observe,passing a residence near the lake minutes later physical evidenceprocessed by the Ohio Bureau of Criminal Investigations from thetownship administration building, as well as Mister mackrer's, recoveredvehicle, resulted in matching Brian mackron's DNA DNA and blood found inand around the bathroom Sak and on the fousit matchd. Only Brian mackron, thebloody footprints located in the administration building were consistentwith the shoes Brian mackrin was wearing at the time his body wasrecovered, no additional blood from anyone else was obtained in or aroundthe administration building or in or around his vehicle. As a matter of duediligence and standard protocol, several emergency responders andtownship employees. DNA profiles were obtained in the case of crossexamination or cross contamination of the scene. So what Captain Sedner issaying is that at no time did they ever find any DNA from that scene? It didn'tmatch Frian, macron or blood that didn't match bride mackron right, which, when I hear that I thinkokay, maybe he did good Soi di. There was a long way to kind of proving thatPrim macronacted alone, because Darren you're going through the BCI file, andyou found a recorded interview with who was it. It was detective cartright with the BCI agent and he was kind of likepassing off the case when the BCI took over and it talks about stuff. That'snever been mentioned to us in the Media Wat. I think we should play Howka Jim, run record ow on the tape ofcorter rether. It's August thirteen Wednesday, two Thousanda and twenty.The time now is apprationate poin. Ten. Twenty Six am, and you know I'm Speciallavden CharleScneyder from Ohio BCI. I give you one of my cards o make and I'm going to talk to you about theBrian mccrone question death case that occurred onDecember, initiated it. I think, on December. Sixteen two thousand andsixteen I know at one point there was something about. There was a Hispanic Ito work for the ATOF, servs departnert or something there was a thing aboutblood or something he cuting hmself in the garage orsomething like that and his blook wit. Some of them was foundon that and yo drop of water. Something was fond someplace on something I if Iunderstand it correct ly so o that was Yougotta know o you're talking about. No, that was the blood. The blood wasfounding. What they thought was blood was on that fueld tank hever. It wasn'this glu, we never got hat. We got ever got Ta link between anybody, okay, okay,maybe I'Vesu that the only thing we did don't the biggest on O interquestions,whose Das on the DOORKNOB and the inside of the comfrente and who's DNAis on the tall in dumpster yeah. I, what did HEU ever compare the to to seeif they were connecten, no n, think so what are we just hear that they found abloody tell right and they got DNA on a door that they don't know whos, that is,they can't match it to any of the people that they should be menting itto right. I mean it's just it's crazy. This is at the end of the interview.They have gone through this interview and he has tried to Slan it towardssuicide suicide. Suicide and then all of a sudden he's like wow, we got DNA,we've got blood, we got a bloody cow and we don't even know if they link andto me more than anything that just that center press conference, where hesays the only source of DNA was Brian. You know you can even say we foundother DNA and it ever really matched anything, and this is a public buildingwith people in and out. But you didn't...

...say that, like no you're trying to kindof set the tables that we hear what you want us to hear, but you should vementioned there are outstanding DNAs that haven't been identified. Itdoesn't mean that the murderer. I mean they. You know chances. Are It's notbut blood and there's outstanding blood right? Well, we know motible peoplework in that building every day. So if you didn't collect Thena, that'sweirder right and you did a bad job yeah right, but we got DNA ONA Dornathat what Brian would have used more than likely to get into that room andto leave and it's it doesn't match. Bryant, it's not Bryan's. It's there.It's fresh, it was able to be harvested. At that point I mean it's one thing: toleave a fingerprint or something it's another thing to leave DNA right. Imean it to just right Itougf, it's almost like whal. We found a smokinggun, but it wasn't Brian, so yeah now the bloody towe. So they find thisbloody tow in the dumpster and he it's not in the interview we played, but hechalked it up to a ambulance gentleman like wiping downafter they transported somebody in rather than throwing it and fiohazard.He threw it in the dumpster, which I mean could have happened irresponsibly,but wouldn't that have been an easy thing to rule out. I mean how manytimes you think that ambulance goes out and it's a weekly dumpster dump. Whycouldn't you just pull those people submit DNA samples and rule out if thattowel wasn't you know what that's not the only interesting thing that wasfound in the dumbster and I got going through the BCI file about the knihethere's a message from Paul to Charlie at BCI, and he said hear that a knifewas recovered from the scene. Do you have any more info about this knife andhopefully your people? This is Pauby and Paul had enough common sense topreserve it and send it to a lab for fingerprinting and DNA analysis, and soCharlie reaches out to Mydina County Sheriff's apartment. They said well, wethink at we maybe had a knife, but we threw it away and then they go back,and this is all in the BCI file they're trying to look for it and they'resending out these different emails to different people, so one that comesdown to one of their patrolment thinks that it was his own life that he threwaway in the dumpster at the bloody disastrous via Macal crime scene or wasrecovered from there. He says in in that exchange. He says he threw it awaybefore Brian Wen missing, but he use that dumpster but use that dopster I mean come on like how are we supposedto get our hads around this? How re we supposed to have any kind of trust inthis investigation when anything that they pull out of there? That points toanything other than FRI ameicaan acting alone. It's like they got a story forit like that's. Just a bloody tell that Amila driver decided to throw away the dumpster, and then theknife is like well, one of our home cops. was there a week or so before biwent missing. It was throwing away knives in that dumpster like t the hell,but if it's more than a week ago, dumpsters dumped every week, I believeon Mondays, so he had to have been there within thelast couple days to do that. Now I listen to his interview with Charlieand he claimed that he possibly threw out a knife at that point. He didn'texactly know what day he was there cleaning it out his car, but he said hefound it in the back of his cruiser. So if you're in distress and you're in theback of a police cruiser, there could be a knife back ther just keep an eyeup. I mean that's what he said you know. So I mean that's just crazy that, likeyou know the whole thing it's just like. I have lost some trust. I guess in howinvestigations are carried out and it is not like CSI at all now. Anotherbomb show that is also in the BCAR report is allegedly. There was also aknife found around Chipa Lake and that...

...also they felt wasn't related by theBiu. They didn't have Fryan at the time, so they didn't necessarily know stabwoons, but you know they're walking around. They got a bloody scene, butonce again, though, as soon as they walked in here, they thought staged,Sene. Okay, everybody that's going to do it for this episode every time Ithink we're done with the Brian Makrin case, there's just new things that areuncovered. So I think, we'll probably at least do one more episode discussingsome of these things before we move on to our next project. I also want you toknow that we are on facebook or on twitter. We have an instagram accountthat you can check out and almost all of the material that we're referencingminus. Some of the audio interviews are available on our webpage, which iswwwdt, invisible ships podcastcom so check it out. You can read the BCIreport there for yourself. Everyone stay safe, well, see you next time theinvisible ships podcast is produced by invisible ships, productions, LLC allrights reserved for more information, go to www dot,invisible ships, podgastcom.

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