Invisible Ships podcast
Invisible Ships podcast

Episode 9 · 2 years ago

Murder Lake 4

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

We learn more about Bryon's life in the jewelry business from Victoria and Paul talks about how some Sheriff's Dept service weapons may have been illegally bought and sold. If that is true did Bryon Macron know anything about it? Could this be another motive to have him removed?

An elected official in the Dinah goes missing. Brian macrin went missing Friday under circumstances by Dinah County investigators have deemed suspicious. suspicious. It was just days before Christmas in two thousand and sixteen when a maintenance worker found blood in the Lafayette Township Trustees Office and sighs of a fight. Then macrins SUV turned up near Chippewa Lake, just a few miles away. No sign of him until February when a kayaker found him floating. His siblings, children, friends don't know what happened to him. Kurry doesn't have a husband and I don't have a son. They're hoping investigators learned something soon what happened to Brian macarn and why. The former trustees body was found in Chippewa Lake in February, and family members say they just want to know what caused is death. If he was the only person involved, then how is the cause of death undetermined? Preliminary autopsy resolt showed stab wounds on his body. Cause of death undetermined, but the coroner has not determined the cause of death or if the stab wounds cost his death. We are back with another episode of the invisible ships podcast. Yeah, it's great to be bad. Thanks for listening. We're going to jump right back into the Victoria macron interview in one minute, but we just want to touch on some stuff from the last episode real quick. I was really, really glad that we got Brian Popovich on the show. I think he made that episode. When he described the crime scene, when he described the knives, it gave me chills. Yeah, that was a great interview and it really it brought up a lot of kind of corroborating evidence from his witness count and also he had some different takes on some stuff. So I think it gave us a lot more to kind of chew on. Yeah, and you know what, he came to us. He was just listening to the show and he commented and we've been finding out so many amazing things from the people that are listening to the show, that are commenting. We haven't been digging in this case as long as everybody else has our along, as some of you guys have webs loose out there. Keep digging, websues facebook, the invisible ship's community. Keep digging, keep giving us these tips. We love to hear when you disagree with us because we had another one with the drone situation right one of the kind of mysteries. Yeah, a great comment from a woman that was listening to the show and she contacted us and she put forth a theory that the reason they didn't fly the drone was potentially because the weather was too bad, too chaotic that day. And if you remember from the last episode, Victorian Macron, you know, was explaining with her frustration how the police in the search and rescue people didn't fly a drone even though they had people trained to fly drone. Yeah, and a drone. The Madonna County shares a bar and bought these drones back in two thousand and thirteen and they were specifically there for search and rescue. So victory macm was talking about how, you know, there's a reason to believe that Brian might be in that lake at that time and they should have put the drone out. But this listener was telling us that, you know, her theory was a potentially the weather was too bad, to chaotic to fly the drone. So I did a little bit of research and I was trying to pin down the weather data from that day. Unfortunately, going back through historical stuff. Not all weather stations, or at least that I could find, were available online. So I looked at Cleveland right and you know, it wasn't that crazy. We saw wind gusts between ten and thirteen miles an hour and snow off and on, but it wasn't heavy early in the day and they found Brian's car around eight or nine am, so it would have been time to put it in there. And it's kind of researching too. So these commercial drones, they basically if you had wind gusts of ten to thirteen miles an hour, you'd be able to fly them. There's a rule of thumb with drones and if we have listeners, Dan, we need to get...

...the people that I listen to show that know more about meteorology than we do or more about drones, which is basically like we know nothing about it, though, so you probably know more than us. Contact us, but I think there's a rule of thumb as far as whatever the top speed of the drone is. You can fly up to like two thirds in Theo in that wind speed, right. So I and ten mile per hour wind day with like snow flurries. That's not that's not a very even remarkable. Right. These aren't drones from target. So we if we have any amateur meteorologists or any drone pilots out in our community, we love to hear from you. You can email us that chips invisible at gmailcom or head up our website, invisible ships podcastcom. Yep, and we're about to roll the interview. I just wanted to say one other thing to we got so much awesome feedback from so many people and we love what you guys are doing. Their stuff I can't talk about right now. We got some back channel stuff that is so exciting. I wish I could share it with you. I just can't yet. It's a little bit too early. But I want to let you know that you guys are helping us get the worried out. It's getting noticed and is getting noticed in a really, really, really big way that I cannot talk about because there's something in the works. But keep doing what you're doing, keep sharing it, keeps spreading it, stay tuned. And as far as back channel stuff goes, one of our listeners has been fantastic. He is he wants to remain anonymous in the total respect that so we have to give them some kind of handle. I want to do like a secret service handle for him. Yeah, and you know, you really put a lot of thought into this and you came up with some cool options. And I know there was a lot of owl options. Where were some of those? Owl Passenger, innocent owl, different stupid things like that. I had a online secret service handle generator. But what do we end up? What are we and pull and so we ended up with Cohen. It's just kind of a cool sounding name. It's easy to say and it comes from an ancient Buddhist reward for like a riddle. So it's appropriate. And Cohen, I know you're listening. You're the guy that we've been kind of feeding stuff too, and you've been giving US stuff and we've been trying out different theories and you've been checking stuff for us and maybe opening a big doorway to get some answers. So maybe one day we can get you on the show, obviously under your new invisible ship's secret service handle, pseudonym. Yeah, you're suiting them. But anyway, thank you, guys. You are all awesome and you really helping us, because this is about all of us in our community. But now we're going to go into the interview. So, if you remember the last episode, we kind of cut off the Victoria macron interview to jump into the paint interview. We're going to go back to where we cut from the Victoria macron interview, and this is good. You're going to hear a little bit more from Paul Hartman on here too. Actually hear a lot from Paul Hartman, and he's starting too in this part. Shouldn't the interview give us some very valuable insight and I think you're going to enjoy it. So sit back and listen. Let's roll it right. So that goes to them. That goes to my belief. So what was saying? That it was a horrific scene, right, and that's I mean, it definitely makes sense. I mean, and also I mean if that's the crime scene and he lost enough blood to eventually, you know, lose his life, you have to lose a lot, you know, even if you take one cup and you spread it across the floor, it looks a lot worse than just inside the cup. You know, a little bit of blood goes a long way. Yeah, and they lose enough to lose his life. Now, how about the so so they brought a painter in and then they rip the carpet up and took care of that. So there was basically no crime scene to go back and pull more evidence from. Does that sound about right? Correct. Yeah, so the car. So what? So the car?...

They sorry, going ahead. None. Come to find out, none of that was none of that was preserved, he said. Correct. Yeah, would you say? Did they so samples that they collected? Did they still have those? Right, Dad, I don't know. I don't know. Gets there, finds this crime scene, calls, the calls Sanford, not not nine, one one called, okay, but Sandford kind kind of had his he's been a he's been around this whole time. He's kept in the in the loop. They get they find his car by pinning the the on star. Right, as hard as I know. Yet that they and then they find his car. They said they found some blood in the car. Right, correct. It was the blood in the driver's seat, the passenger seat, the trunk. Do we know even where this blood was? I believe where they found it was the driver's area, okay, and the gear shift. Okay. So as if Brian possibly drove that car. Is that? What? Is that what they're trying to lead us to believe or what? Don't know. Yeah, I don't know, okay. Or someone that was attacking Brian then drove that car, because Brian was a pretty pretty capable guy, right, I mean that that's kind of the article said. He's a guy that could take care of himself. He had training from the Marines, good sized guy. Yeah, so someone that's not going to just get taken down by probably one person. Right. Well, exactly, and that's why we think the way the was on the neck, I could have the muscles. Okay, rate that. We come to that conclusion, Paul, like the way? Yeah, yeah, it appears that the the long at the base of the neck on the right hand side likely severed the muscle, so that incapacitated his his ability to move. Yeah, that movement. Yeah, so maybe like the uppercher pass muscle probably would have probably been hit, which would have been a big arm elevator. Right, so you wouldn't have been able to really move that arm at that point. Right. Is that what you gtter saying? Right? Right, so then so he gets but then also just a move Brian wouldn't have been an easy task. At about two hundred and ninety pounds. Would you say. Well, and here's another thing, because they never interviewed me, they had all the information in correct. Okay, where they got this information? I don't know. It was just ours had taken up of him and the county con the Party, sent it to me because Adam Adam was a former marine as well. So I don't know why she was really sending this photo. Was the two of them standing next to each other. And Linda, throughout all of this, is inserted herself and they've pretty much gone through Linda before they ever came to me.

I never gave them the information of his height, his weight or any clothes that I think he was wearing. Wow, ever asked me the entire time. Wow. Never. Well, what would you say is wait, was all this information went out and I had to make flyers, missing flyers just before the poplarer jump, Uh Huh, because I knew it was going to get some publicity down there and it would be a turnout of a lot of people that live in the area. So I thought this would be a great opportunity to put his face up the information. If anybody happed to me confidentially, call and I started. When I want those fires squad I want all the information to be correct. So I've been starting to look at this information that's being released at might wait a minute, he doesn't wait to ninety he because the quarters of swept that they said was on him is on our chair upstairs. Oh Jeez, are bad room? Okay, so that somebody is giving information that is incorrect and it wasn't. I never gave any of the information. They never get keep to being asked and if they, whoever they got it from, they should have up. Would it's going to your driver's license, even that would be a bit more accurate, even if they didn't ask it for me. Wouldn't you go to a driver's license or something sort of bad id yes, sitting here right now, that's what I would have thought they would have pulled it from. Would have been, you know, from his driver's license, but that wasn't what is on his driver's license either. Well, driver's license was more at his driver's license. I believe I put him at put was like two hundred and forty nine. Wow, so forty pounds. That's a yeahs and they had him at six one. Brian was not six one. where, I mean, Pi don't know. And it leads me to believe that they were getting this information from one doll and she's just given out an instimation. Just Ca. Yeah, who is when? Da, yeah, when I'm his spouse. I'm his spouse, I'm the one closest to him. You come and ask me. HMM. But they didn't. They felt like they had it all figured out without yet sounds. Yeah, they were getting everything. You're going to hurt for everything. So that's why this is just so yeah, then the reason they were telling me BCI was involved from the get go day, like, like from when. Okay, so they are telling me from the beginning BC I was involved and I started feeling while from the beginning I felt weird about this whole thing, like I can't trust anybody. But every day on my break, I get a break at thirty, I would go out to my car and I make a call to the detectives cartwright, and I'd say, do you know anything? Do you have any updates? If I thought of anything or I could think of anything that would help, I would tell him. He would always say no, we don't have anything. We know more by Friday and this detective cart raising is with, who he's with, becires you at the staff's office. He's with the sheriff's Office. But then he would start...

...saying. Well, he said, we sent more into BECI, but we can only send seven to I think like seven to ten pieces at a time. And I'm thinking, wait a minute, I thought you said BCI was involved from the beginning. He said, yes, they are, but we can only send so much in. And a time out thinking if they were involved and they came to the scene, they would take all the inform, all any information they needed. They would take any evidence, they would take it all. What do you mean? You're sending things into them. Yeah, so that was sending up a red flag to me. Like and and too, would beci is involved and any any crime, anything, you always see their van in front of the scene. Yeah, the news and I never saw their van in any photos of the town hall. So they're not like you know what, BCI was not involved. They never called them either. Yeah, so and then so. So, basically how bt I got involved was eventually they turned over, after they collected the evidence, the sheriff's department collected the evidence, they sent over so much that they wanted to be tested and eventually they ran out of stuff the test and they said it was in Bciz and is that? Is that what happened? or how did they it was in BCI in rich field. That was an office that was handling it and then when it got turned over, they claim it was BCI. That's where they were sending everything, BCI rich field. The prosecutor told me he was taking it out of rich field after the after the sheriffs conducted their investigation, and I put that in clothes they were. The prosecutor said he wants it further looked at. That was two years in, Paul, wasn't it June of two thousand and eighteen? Victory Two thousand and eighteen. Yeah, so it was two years later that they turned it over to BCI out of new London, okay, and I asked why and that was because someone for the sheriff's Department worked at BCI rich field. Interesting. Interesting. So someone that previously worked for Medinah County Sheriff's Office now worked at the BCI and rich good is what you're saying? No previous. I just said that they worked for one of somebody that works for the Department Work Bridge Shield or for the DC and rich shield. Interesting. And then the prosecutor, the prosecutor wanted it, sent you a different agency, Beci location and the items that were in the car were never searched in January te thousand, wasn't it? Call? Yeah, that's that's my recollection. Is that the tags on the bag? You have like January fifteen or sixteen, something like that. It was what would be January seventeen, okay, wasn't it? Yeah, it wasn't time for sure. So, yeah, several weeks later. It was a month after. It was a month after. I do know that. So what what things did they collect from the car? Um, well, they picked and choose what they wanted to send in and they had returned a...

...few items to me. It said a blanket and a pillow in the very back. No, why would brian have us? Why would he have a blank in the pillow in the back? Well, because, and they asked me that, they and I said we had gone to Football Playoff Games, Huh, for the football team, and I know that's why the blanket was in the back and the pillow just you know, we have kids or whatever and it was thrown in the back. Okay. So, but the blanket that was in the back, the blanket in the pillow they returned to me, and separate bags. They only released a couple items to me. I don't have any clothes or I don't have anything like that. It was a the blanket, pillow and a couple other things they found in the car. Well, the bottom line here is that, nope, we don't know what they took out of the car. Yeah, we really don't. Yeah, and they might have searched it before they even had the proper authority to search. And it sounds like that's probably true. Yes, okay, just like they were in your house before. They would venture to guess, because we asked them for copies of search warrants and they never provided anything. They should have had a certain work to search the car. They obviously did not. Uh Huh. Interesting. Well, and that sets goes back to that my shot my feelings on a shotty investigation from day one, when Stanford came here and wants to write, I'm a serial number of his phone from the copy that they gave me. Yeah, you should already have this. Why are you doing like what you're doing? You're not. Remember, when we ask them expressly for copies of any search warrants? Yes, in fact, I think Dick died that and and we got absolutely nothing back. There are no search warrants. Yeah, interesting. Yeah, I don't believe there is. And here's what, and let me tell you what the value of bad is that, you know, is that evidence that admissible in court? You can see a warrant, right, yeah, right, again. So if they've got something of some value, is it going to be admissible because they did not obtain a warrant and received a lawfully? Yeah, so kind of like the question that we keep going back and forth with is is the sheriff, did the sheriff, was a Chriff, involved in this? Or is the sheriff, you know, covering it up or they just that bad at the investigation freat you know, where does it lie? Do you have any comment on that at all? Oh, I'm sure the Victoria's got play. Yeah, like I said, from day one there started to be a trust factor where I started my own spiral notebooks and I was writing down at one time Lynda bowers, we work, I was taking my daughter down to check her into Ohio state and this was just after the Christmas holiday. So Alex was going to be checking in now to Ohio state and she had called me and she said, Hey, I have somebody that has trained like search dogs that...

...they offered that they can go out and do a search around, you know, the town hall and down by Chippewa and I said, Oh okay, well when? And she's like, well, listen, we're not going to tell the sherifft apart and I'm just going to have them do it. And he said, well, when? And she said, well, it'll be on Sunday. And I'm like all, I said, Linda, I have to take Alex Down to school, I have to check her into her dorm. All that's okay, she said, don't worry about I'll take care of it all. I'll be with him, will go through and whatever. You know, will keep in touch with you through the day. And I'm like, Oh my God, like I want wanted to be there. Yeah, and she's like no, your daughter needs you. Just go be with your daughter. It's okay, so she said, but he needs some clothes of Brian's, like anything that would have Brian scent on it. So I said, okay, I could probably find stuff, she said, and bring a pair of like his tennis shoes so I gathered up what I had, what I thought would still have a scent on it, and I put it in a bag and she says, you know, drop it off to my house. I'm thinking, you know what, I'm gonna call like, I didn't tell her this, but I'm like, she's always involved, always involved, and I thought, you know what, I'm going to call him direct and I'm going to take it to him. Yeah, so I did. She gave me his name and she messaged me that morning. She said clothes, and I messaged her and I said, Oh, I've already dropped them off. Oh okay. So when I drop them off to the gentleman that lives off Ryan wrote, he has newfoundland dogs that he has and he's he's a dog trainer, but he said, you know, he could possibly pick up a cent whatever with his dogs. So I drop them off and I said listen, Marty, I said I want to be updated through the entire day. You need to let me know, you need to let me know if you find anything. Please keep in touch with me. He said, Oh, yes, I will, and I said, okay, I'm going to you. I told him I'll be a don't how to stay with my daughter. I'm in you know, my phones on. Whatever you need. I don't hear anything. I don't hear anything all day. I get home from a house stay, I call him. I said, what happened? Why didn't you call me? He said Linda was the conduit. Everything went through her. WHOA? So he was for Linda said not to call you. Basically, yeah, he said, I'm so sorry. He goes, Linda was the conduit. Everything went through her. Now, let me break in here if I if I can for a moment. And there was an issue about the competence of this sheriff's department, which is like a scale of one to ten minus five. Yeah, but yeah, there were. There was evidence recovered from a dumpster in the vicinity of the town hallows at the players. They recovered, now, remember, there was a bloody scene. They recovered a knife, a bag of seats and business cards and add some bloody cows. Now then gloves, right and good. And so would you not, being a criminal investigator, would you not think there might be some connection between a bloody scene and a knife? Yeah, and I read that in your blog a little bit. So, yeah, elaborate on that. They...

...threw it away they threw it all away and heaven how did you know about it? How did you know it was there? Who? Who told us it was? Somebody had thrown it out in the say. How you found out it is during one of those conversations with these buffos the sheriff's office. They disclosed that to you. Yeah, they found it in in a crew. They say. They found it in a cruiser, right, and they took it from the cruiser and threw it in the trash at the fire station and they took the fire station, took the garbage and dumped it in the dumpster and they found it in the dumpster. So the fire department found in the dumpster or the investigators then went and found it in the dumpster, the sheriff's department. But they said it originally came from a cruiser. Wow, and it was. It was in the town hall there, not the town hall, the Fire Station Garbage can, your garbage can, was taken from them. It's a fun took it from the garbage and threw it in the big dumpster, you know, like to take it out for the trash. And so they recovered it, or they found it right, but then they decided it wasn't evidence and just threw it away. Basically, is that kind of like their conclusion? That's that. That's correct. Yes, we have since made inquiry and from the BCI agent and they don't it's not on hand. So they pitched it. So, you know, brilliance, right. Really, they said they determined it and have anything to do with it. It's like they determined Brian left to go stirfing in California. Yeah, they told me. They told me he ran away. He ran away. When did they tell you that? It just curious. Very early on that they think, because that came out in the article pretty early on. I think that they thought maybe he was very early on team and they said, well, we believe he ran away. Wow, with all that blood in the office. Okay, so when you have a situation where your loved one is missing and you can go down this road and you can believe that either he ran away or it's this road and it's not where you want to go, yeah, which would be death, there's two ways, either we ran anyway or he's not living. Right, but which way would you want to go down? Okay, I'm going to try to say that. Then maybe he did run away why he would run away. I have no idea why he would run away, but I would want to believe that over the other. Yeah, so I'm thinking, do they have some type of evidence? It says they he ran away. I don't know because if they did, there's certain times like they can't tell you things that they might know. So I started to believe that that. I guess that's where on going. Why? Why would he run away? And if he did run away, why? Well, here's the problems. Yeah. Well, the problem is you have a bloody scene, his phone is recovered and as his is his car. So what is the means and the opportunity to run away, right, isn't that not? Well, exactly exactly, but if you're if you have to believe one thing, because running away means I'll see him again. Great, actually, I'll see him again. My children will see him again. But if you go down this path, it's not where you want to go,...

...but it's death. Well, I don't like what you're saying, but as an investigator, as it were, he doesn't support that crackt. No. Well, especially a guy who, I mean, it doesn't make any sense to run away marriage or twenty three years, three girls, very well involved in the community. I mean he's a guy that, I mean, all of his life revolves around really my Dina. I mean, you know, he's a football I mean he just, you know, you can see that. It's such a clear thing of the picture that I think we've all got of him. So, I mean, yeah, the running away didn't make sense. It didn't make sense, almost like the distract in a way, you know. Yeah, and they immediately bring up that Hinckley, where the police officer went missing in this car, was at the late up at lake. Now, yeah, we put that out there. You know, it's to just but but if, if they would have, if they knew, which they did, the amount of blood at that office there would have been, there should be no logical reason. I see. If you guys agree with this, let me know that. They would say that he ran away, but that's what they were telling that's what they wanted me to believe. Okay, and that it will find you. One of the articles that sites an unnamed investigator who claimed the that very thing, and the basis of what fact is unknown to me no one. Thing you have to understand. Here's the way these guys treated it at the sheriff's Office. Everything is speculation, nothing is fact. Yeah, okay, you know. So share sus gave me his direct cell phone number. He's like, if you ever need anything, you just call me. I'll be able to pick up the phone. Let me know. I call them. He never picked up the phone. He said to me at one point. He says, you know, if Brian ran away, he goes, I'm really a good friend of his. He goes, he would be the first to call me. Doesn't have his phone, right. How's he going to call you? And most people don't know your cell phone. It's on auto dial. Yeah. So, so sentner and Brian, what relationship that you know of with center, Between Center and down Brian? Brian did ride along. Brian would go and he had a pass and access passed to the sheriff's department. He could go up there and talk to them at any time. He didn't need an escort through the building, basically, so he could go up there at any time and talk to stuff, attack to them about whatever they were police force. Yeah, because love downs. It doesn't have a place at the t use the sheriff's department in contract for our police service. So a lot of times they'd have issues or, you know, what the costs were going to be, whatever, I whatever. They shoot the breeze. You know. He became friendly with them. He go out on Swat calls with them. So so setting her knew Brian very well, but did they ever have any like, did they go get together outside of work at all? I think I think you need to back up there. I don't think he knew Brian very well. Okay, I think I think they were carequaintances. Sure, okay. Did they go out and do things together? No, no, outside of work business. Know. Okay, and then real quick, let's cover Brian's job as the wholesale jeweler. Uh Huh. So, so, like in the article is first coming out, it was like, you know, and different...

...people that I personally you know, just kind of like pulling the community on. You know. It's like, well, I wonder if it's something to do with that wholesale jeweler. You know that he could have been carrying loose diamonds, he could have had a lot of money or or something like that. Can you comment about or give me a little background on Brian? What Brian's job was like, what it entailed, what dangers it had Brian. Brian was insured to carry the jewelry. So most of the jewelry did not have center of stones, which that is changed over the years because years ago there was a center stone that was a real diamond, but because of the cost of diamonds and the insurance and people were getting wrapped, they've changed the way that they would travel. So most of what Brian had were mountings. So they would have either a SE Z in the main mounting, like if you want to see what the whole stone looks like, if it has diamonds on either side, then there would be a head in the center with a Cez because it cut the cost down of the rain. But the side stones were always real those diamonds. They've also changed the way. They weren't as when they would travel. Now they started making the castings. They weren't white gold or yellow gold anymore. They were making them out of stirling silver because that cut the cost down. So it made the industry less vulnerable to robberies and things like that because they were cutting the costs of so if Brian would go, Brian was the their company manufactured for the store that Brian would sell to. So he would go into a store and say, you know, here's my line. What do you like? The customer would say, Oh, give me ten of these, ten of these, seven of these, and he would distribute them to his stores. So he would have those on hand or would he have to go get to know? They would order them. Like his was the sample line, but the sample line was, like I said, sterling silver and C zs. But then when it was manufactured it would be sent to them direct and it would be the real, real diamonds, with white gold or yellow gold, however they preferred to. So he never delivered it or never took the money directly. He was just kind of like an in between guys, demonstrating it, showing it. Yeah, he would show the jewelry to the store. He would have. He briand out with mostly your mom and pop stores. There's other stores that they would or other sales guys that would do them, what they call the majors, which is your chain stores like Rogers, Sterling, Jab Robinson, that type of yeah, buying out with the MOM and pop stores. They might have two or three stores and one state. So he had stayed all over East, west coast and in between. So he would travel out the he'd traveled by like playing like he wouldn't just travel regionally, like to go to the places. He would travel locally, had a lot of local customers, but he would also travel, you know, across the United States wherever his customers were. What he had built a good customer base over the many years and very trustworthy. Anybody you talked to, they love Brian. He was an honest, straightforward guy and they loved them. Yeah, what dangers with the job what? So obviously you said that you know, not caring nearly as...

...much as you used to do. As far I mean you'd go through, he said it certain times, like they go through checkpoint at because they carried it in roller bag or a large duffel bag, uh Huh, and they would come in Tradis like these plastic trays and then they'd be velcrowde with like these straps. So he have numerous trees and each stack and then they put them in there like roller bag or and they were only insured up to a certain amount. So they couldn't carry over that because that would be a liability them. So, you know, they had an interms company that was, you know, ensured them through the company and but there were times when he would get to the airport and you'd get somebody through Tsa Angle, you know, hey, oh my God, look at this jewelry, and he's like look at them and say could you please shut your mouth, like I don't need a flashing light at the top of my head that I have a backful of jewelry. Oh No, but there was you have to be careful, you know, going into there were guys that were hitting dropped. If I can in a kick here too, it's known that he carried a firearm. One he was traveling locally. Okay, and I've gone this missing. It was stolen during the homicide. MMM okay, which is, you know, this ship and he made my friends to that. We found that out because he his cousin has a jewelry store and his cousin's son saw the gun that Brian was talking about. So you didn't know about the gun until all this has happened, right till the till. The cousin, I mean I know he has, he has, he has, and I have that and that's in the safe, but that it's not the guy, but he had a different gun. That then you're said your cousin or your cousin, my cousin, his cousins son, God, saw a different gun that you do not have. So yeah, and I found that out from his cousin when him saying yeah, he came to the storerooms and said, hey, did you see this gun I have? Okay, so I don't know where. That is interesting. It's interesting they would take that whenever. You know, there was no obviously gunshot wounds or anything. Well, I think that he kept the gun in the green travel bag in the car and that is missing. So I don't know. I don't have that green travel bag. So they stole it's a bottom line. So that gun is missing and and we know it's not locked up an evidence somewhere right. Well, we don't know that. And the product we've got been well, they don't have it at the chair of stops. You can be sure of that. But the reality is that I've been trying to find the serial number because that Gud could have easily been picked up by the police and sitting in an evidence room even now, which of course, is a good lead to the homicide. But I can't so far I have not been able to identify the serial number. Okay. So possibly crying bought this in it wasn't registered. Is that what you're saying? Well, if se bought it, well that's it was a clock. We know that it was the Zemo pistol. So I went to the manufacturer and and said what and inquired as to whether or not he had registered the firearm with a company, which is a an option, but they're records indicate that he did not. So that potentially means that he purchased it. Either...

...he didn't fill out the registation card or he purchased it from another person right in which base they would be no firearms rectors at all. So that's kind of where we're out there. Okay, so jewelry business doesn't seem to be a likely lead possibly to the cause of his death. All that wasn't even don't because he had the jewelry here at the house in his trays. I don't it was in the I believe it was in the vault or in front of the vault, but they never came for a month after to pick it up. They weren't worried about it. Okay, so he had no jewelry in the car? No, not that I'm aware of Ted Bundy, murdered my dad's friend sister in one thousand nine hundred and seventy four while on his reign of terror in Utah. At least, Bundy admitted to killing her just before his excution, but police were never able to locate her body. That's the topic of just one episode on straight UP ENIGMAS, a podcast to explore the unexplained. We discuss the mysterious deaths of the Jamison family, share terrifying true stories from real people about sleep paralysis and explorer Cleopatra's missing tomb. I'm Jaden mckel and I'm the host of straight up enigmas. Our bite sized biweekly episodes focus on the world's strangest mysteries, sacred and sonic geometry, the murder of Karen Silkwood, Turkmeni stands door to hell, the curse of the omen and much more. Listen and subscribe at Apple podcasts or wherever you find podcasts. All right, well, that's going to do it for our episode today. Next episode we're going to jump right back in, or really kind of getting into the Meda these interviews and there's a lot coming out. Yeah, I think that in this what we just heard, Paul Hartman may have given another motive for the Brian macron murder. I mean when they're talking about illegal gun dealings, or at least allegedly guns being distributed illegally, it's just another angle to a case that's built out of angles. Yeah, we're definitely not lacking for any kind of motives. Real quick piece of housekeeping. I know at the end of the last episode we said we might be featuring a a surprise interview. That's still coming down the rude hope, but do to some scheduling things, we haven't been able to record it yet. So say tuned to that and be sure to check out our website at invisible ships podcastcom. Right now we have a pull up and we want to hear from you. Yeah, it's really cool to see the comments that people are leaving on this pool, so check it out. If please, leave us a rating and subscribe on Itunes. That tells the Algorithm to let other people know about our show and hopefully build our community even more. All right, so we'll see you all next time.

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